ATV users don't really want to weed out the "bad apples"

[Nemont]

except the part where you state the other 990,000 ride illegally as well

TB,

Go and reread the post of mine that you quoted. Then tell me where I said the other 990,000 riders were riding illegally. Never said it. What I said is that using this number there would be 110,000 illegal riders tearing stuff up, and that doesn't even count the impact upon the land of the other 990,000. Are you implying that even legal riding has not impact upon the resource? That is like saying legal hunting has no impact on herd size.

Nemont

 

[Ten Bears]

I never said that legal riding has NO impact. Can you show me any "use" that has no impact? Can you show me where making something totally illegal has stopped the illegal activity? Making something illegal is only as good as the ability to police it.

 

[mtmiller]

Alright, this one has been beat to hell and it seems everyone is arguing for the sake of arguing.

Lets start another discussion.

 

[MattK]

TB/Ringer-
If you give any access to an area for atv use, it tends to spread like mold. They will travel legal roads for a while but the adventurers will eventually end up making secondary trails and then trails off of those etc. etc. They always end up in a spot they were not supposed to be, ALWAYS. Therefore if you ban them from the entire area, it will at least limit the illegal use.

I just read an article in the Missioulian about illegal atv use in the Swan. Over 50% of the gated, no access, tore up roads had signs of illegal travel. All of them posted for no motorized vehicles. Over 50%!!! Yep, areas allowing atv travel are dying and the atv industry is pulling the trigger on itself.

 

[Nemont]

agreed mtmiiler

 

[Ten Bears]

I agree with MTMILLER, butttttt.....

MATTy, if the area is posted closed to legal riders, the illegal use will continue, and proliferate because the illegal riders have little fear of getting caught by nonriders. I have no doubt that 50% or more of the closed roads had sign of illegal use. How well is it policed? Not well I'd say. How many got caught? Not many (any) I'd guess.

 

[MattK]

The article didn't say the #'s that got caught nor did it mention how well it was policed. The point of the article was the amount of illegal use on gated roads. The people who went out and studied tire tracks were looking at the best method to stop illegal use. They said putting up signs alone does nothing! People who ride atvs evidentally can not read. Gating a road seemed to be a little more effective but they found atvs could circumvent the gate and still ride into the area. The next best was gating, putting up a sign, and tearing up (reclamation) the original road. Still over half these roads were still driven on. The best method was to completely tear up the road and make it look like the surrounding ground (landscape). Some of these areas were still driven on. My question is what the hell do you need to do to keep atv riders from illegally driving into an area.

This is the reason I believe 1st offense...take the atv. Maybe this would gain some attention and make the atv industry begin looking at being responsible!

 

[BigHornRam]

"My question is what the hell do you need to do to keep atv riders from illegally driving into an area."

Landmines.

 

[Ten Bears]

MATTy, the industry is only interested in selling a product. It's the sport\recreation that needs to be addressed. Instead of taking the ATV, I'd rather see the culprets fined and made to pay a "repair fee" for damages. After they pay the fees and fines, they could have their ATV back, if they don't pay - seel the machine

BHR, like poaching, it's gonna take active policing from everyone in the woods. If you see trails\tracks keep track of the days (maybe it's only on weekends or certain evenings), and report it to the LEO. If you have time and\or stock, follow the trail and see where they go. Don't do like the guy near Avery and place spike traps. The LEO's spent more time tracking him down because another hunter stepped on them, then they did looking for the illegal ATVs on that trail.

My question is what the hell do you need to do to keep atv riders from illegally driving into an area.[?]

Active people in the woods to report the times, dates, and descriptions for the LEOs.

 

[MattK]

BHR- I thought about that but the carnage would be too great. I have heard of people setting up spiked boards in areas that go around gates. I personally wouldn't do this because of people walking through might get a nail in the foot. However, in the areas I've heard people doing this it's away from where people walk to get around the gate.

I would love to see the atvers face when he drives a little way up the road with four flat atv tires! Have a nice push back to the truck.

 

[Ten Bears]

MATTy, even legal riders typically carry radial tire repair kits and portable air compressors or tire pumps. And YOU could be held criminally and civily liable for any injuries or damages...... Best to keep your small thoughts to yourself.....

 

[MattK]

TB- Please note, I said I've heard of people doing this...I also said I never would. I've also heard of people using sugar in gas tanks, shooting holes in the atv (when the driver is away), slicing a hole through the tire with their hunting knife, etc.

I don't condone this type of action as it makes the person doing it as illegal as the person driving illegally. However, I can understand the frustration that occurs when you've walked a long way into an area, only to see some jack ass on an atv driving around. There will be a lot more problems in years to come if atv drivers continue to ride into areas closed to motorized vehicles. That I will guarantee.

 

[Ten Bears]

However, in the areas I've heard people doing this it's away from where people walk to get around the gate.

Makes ya wonder how they got there if it's so far back that people don't walk there.

Be sure to keep your sabotage to those you know are illegal.

 

[ringer]

Matt-I understand the frustration and I have reported riders in a wilderness area. The bravado about cutting tires, wrenching engines and sugar is a very dangerous comment. If they are in illegal areas report them. If they are parked in a legal area leave them be. Someone in camo could be steps from you and that's that. There is always someone tougher and meaner than you out there. Take care.

 

[1_pointer]

TB- Hate to break it to you, but No. UT is not flat. How many 13K peaks are in ID?
Plus, I'll be hunting in So. ID wth the ATVers...

 

[MattK]

Ringer- I have never and will never do anything against the law when it comes to atv drivers. I am simply pointing out the level of frustration and anger that has come to my attention when talking to people about illegal atv use. I see the dangers in partaking in illegal activities and decided long ago to stay as far away from any as possible.

I've already posted the method I have used to combat illegal atv use. I will stick with that and hope it is successful.

 

[1_pointer]

Yeah, but wouldn't tearing up illegal ATV fit in the same vein as shooting the 'illegal' wolves???? 'Cmon, I remember more than person here saying that SSS wasn't that bad when it came to wolves, why not ATVs?

 

[BuzzH]

I agree...sss for atv's...

 

[cjcj]

Might as well add "illegals' to the list?.... trouble is thats murder and its a crime... so is killing wolves and vandalizing ATV`s... What would you do if you were coming down a mountain back to your truck/ATV and some ass -hole was trashing your vehicle?

 

[BuzzH]

If I was riding my ATV in a place it was against the law to do so...I'd kind of figure I had it coming...and think twice about doing it again.

I really like the SSS idea for atv's.