Carrion Carrier
Member
Just because kids can hunt does not mean they can shoot cows. That was done away with in many districts last year (the 100's included).
4 year olds with guns
- Thread starter Ben Lamb
- Start date
dustinf
Active member
I had to wait until I was 12 to start hunting. I took my hunter safety course as soon as I turned 12, and even at that young age, I remember thinking it was a joke. We took the test together, and the instructor went through it question by question.
I started hunting with my Uncle, and he probably wasn't the best mentor to have. We small game hunted mostly, and deer camp was more about beer drinking than hunting. Before sunrise, he would walk me to a tree, and say, "Stay here until I come get you."
Which would be after dark. I pretty much sat there shivering for 10 hrs, never seeing a deer.
Luckily, I also started shooting in his gun clubs JOAD archery program that year. If it weren't for some the men there, I'd probably would've quit hunting after the first year.
Long story short, I don't think age has much to do with it. Maturity and the mentors involved are the key. Most guys at work openly admit, their kids tags are basically another tag for them. Yeah, the kids technically pull the trigger, but the dads are doing all the hunting.
I started hunting with my Uncle, and he probably wasn't the best mentor to have. We small game hunted mostly, and deer camp was more about beer drinking than hunting. Before sunrise, he would walk me to a tree, and say, "Stay here until I come get you."
Which would be after dark. I pretty much sat there shivering for 10 hrs, never seeing a deer.
Luckily, I also started shooting in his gun clubs JOAD archery program that year. If it weren't for some the men there, I'd probably would've quit hunting after the first year.
Long story short, I don't think age has much to do with it. Maturity and the mentors involved are the key. Most guys at work openly admit, their kids tags are basically another tag for them. Yeah, the kids technically pull the trigger, but the dads are doing all the hunting.
BuzzH
Well-known member
topgun and rhomas,
I beg to differ...you guys dont have the luxury of knowing what I know having grown up in Missoula Montana when it was just another Western Montana town.
There were many kids I grew up with, both young men and young ladies, that didnt have a choice when it came to hunting. Their parents forced them to hunt, because it was another chance at a cow elk permit and another deer tag to fill. The parents coached them what to say at the check stations if they had game.
I know that things havent changed with this way of thinking in many of the smaller towns across Montana...Plains, Thompson Falls, St. Regis, Superior, Eureka, Troy, Seeley Lake, Darby, Stevensville...the list goes on and on. You dont understand the engrained behavior and sense of entitlement many feel regarding their "right" to kill game...and that includes killing it for their kids.
Its not just as simple as the State forcing their agenda on the public regarding when their kids should be allowed to hunt.
I beg to differ...you guys dont have the luxury of knowing what I know having grown up in Missoula Montana when it was just another Western Montana town.
There were many kids I grew up with, both young men and young ladies, that didnt have a choice when it came to hunting. Their parents forced them to hunt, because it was another chance at a cow elk permit and another deer tag to fill. The parents coached them what to say at the check stations if they had game.
I know that things havent changed with this way of thinking in many of the smaller towns across Montana...Plains, Thompson Falls, St. Regis, Superior, Eureka, Troy, Seeley Lake, Darby, Stevensville...the list goes on and on. You dont understand the engrained behavior and sense of entitlement many feel regarding their "right" to kill game...and that includes killing it for their kids.
Its not just as simple as the State forcing their agenda on the public regarding when their kids should be allowed to hunt.
belly-deep
Active member
- Joined
- Oct 31, 2009
- Messages
- 3,459
I would guess most kids aren't even pulling the trigger on the youth cow hunts
Straight Arrow
Well-known member
I started taking my son hunting when he was six. He hunted rabbits with rocks, then bb gun, then 22 cal, and finally when twelve with his 243. He took his first antelope first day of the season, his first deer and elk first day of the season ... all because he was prepared, with Hunter Safety,marksmanship training, and many hunting experiences all under his belt. I believe that is a good progression and evolution into the great tradition of hunting. However, like others I believe he was ready at age 10 to complete hunters safety and to hunt antelope, deer, and grouse. But children under 10 should be limited to air rifles and a very guarded, limited, and safe introduction to the use of firearms, in my opinion.
Carrion Carrier
Member
Lots of challenges, but why not just ban hunting? That will teach law-benders!
putm2sleep
New member
WTF?! Children under 10 should be limited to air rifles? are you kidding? Surprised you would make such an assinine statement.
In HD 270 last hunting season, 48 antlerless were checked. There were only 20 antlerless B licenses giving in the draw.. If the 20 B licenses were filled at 100% which I am sure they are not, then simple math says in this ONE HD youths checked 28 antlerless elk.
Now FWP knows they only check 50% of the actual kill, based on phone harvest survey. Math can show what youth kill.
Now FWP knows they only check 50% of the actual kill, based on phone harvest survey. Math can show what youth kill.
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putm2sleep
New member
My boy has been going with me and shooting since a very early age. He shoots a compound bow and a 20 ga 870 just fine, saving up for a 25.06
He is 8, and I am one proud dad. His desire and passion for the outdoors and shooting sports is awesome.
'Like' Buzz and Shot-Straight and Top Gun 30-06 comments and opinions.
He is 8, and I am one proud dad. His desire and passion for the outdoors and shooting sports is awesome.
'Like' Buzz and Shot-Straight and Top Gun 30-06 comments and opinions.
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Wapiti Warrior
New member
Nothing says they can't hunt, they just can't hunt BIG GAME if they are younger than 12! There is nothing wrong with the parents taking the kids out bunny hunting with a 22 when they are younger. The kids will learn how to track, and shoot with out a bench, etc...
We don't need a this to be a law!
John
PS> I have 2 kids who followed me both bow hunting and rifle hunting until they turned 12 and then they could carry a gun. By that time they had learned how to navigate through fences safely, and how to wait for a good shot. They shot BB guns out camping with me there teaching them safety and how to carry the weapon.
We don't need a this to be a law!
John
PS> I have 2 kids who followed me both bow hunting and rifle hunting until they turned 12 and then they could carry a gun. By that time they had learned how to navigate through fences safely, and how to wait for a good shot. They shot BB guns out camping with me there teaching them safety and how to carry the weapon.
Topgun 30-06
Active member
BuzzH---Thanks, but I don't need the "luxury" of your knowledge of what goes on anywhere and I'm not saying your statements aren't accurate either. You have stated many times on other threads about how the kids need to get involved at an early age, about how PP systems screw them from being an equal with everyone, etc. Now when this program would give them an earlier chance you are, under your famous statement, "throwing them under the bus"! If what you are saying now goes on, then anyone who knows who is cheating needs to put a stop to it by turning the violators in, and I don't care if it's your own Dad that's the violator! That's the proper, ethical thing to do because they are taking game from all of us illegally. Eliminating the rights/priviledges of the majority because of the misdeeds of a few is exactly what is being discussed in the gun ban debate and please don't say there isn't a direct correlation between the two because there certainly is.
Straight Arrow
Well-known member
putmtsleep, reading comprehension includes reading the entire statement / opinion.
putm2sleep
New member
thats your opinion....
noharleyyet
Well-known member
Bless your heart....
Carrion Carrier
Member
So, no hunting until you're an adult?
I think the discussion everyone wants to have is, "should youths be able to kill cows?"
Carrion Carrier
Member
and that is NOT what this discussion is about.
I simply posted numbers for one HD. No more, no less. Back in post #39 there was some discussion on youth antlerless harvest.
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Carrion Carrier
Member
Hey tjones, I hear ya. Sorry if my response was not perfect.
I do not think that youths should be killing cows in HD's that are below objective.
I do not think that youths should be killing cows in HD's that are below objective.
Pennsylvania has the Youth Mentored program. Its got a strict set of rules that must be followed. For example: Only one firearm may be possesed by the mentor and youth. The mentor must carry the firearm until they reach a stationary position. The youth must always be within arms length, etc. Its been a very safe program so far. As a father of two young outdoors kids, I think its fantastic.
There was a thread started on one of our PA forums awhile back. I couldn't believe how many guys were voicing their opposition to the program. Reading between the lines of the posts, it seemed most of the guys pissing and moaning were doing so because they didn't want some kid killing "their" bucks.
This is my opinion. Time spent in the outdoors with your kids, is time well spent. The hours on stand with a child are priceless. I took both of my kids out, under the Mentored program, this season. We spent hours discussing such subjects such as friends, school, monster trucks, death of animals and family members, modern dance and acro techniques, and many more. Without this time, I'm sure I wouldn't have gotten the chance to touch on some of these important things.
To the guys who don't like the idea, consider a couple of things. Hunter numbers are dropping across the country. Slobs and crooks will always be just that. The vast majority of people participating in this program will be trying to teach their kids, about life, death, woodsmanship, the outdoors, game laws, and wildlife conservation.
There was a thread started on one of our PA forums awhile back. I couldn't believe how many guys were voicing their opposition to the program. Reading between the lines of the posts, it seemed most of the guys pissing and moaning were doing so because they didn't want some kid killing "their" bucks.
This is my opinion. Time spent in the outdoors with your kids, is time well spent. The hours on stand with a child are priceless. I took both of my kids out, under the Mentored program, this season. We spent hours discussing such subjects such as friends, school, monster trucks, death of animals and family members, modern dance and acro techniques, and many more. Without this time, I'm sure I wouldn't have gotten the chance to touch on some of these important things.
To the guys who don't like the idea, consider a couple of things. Hunter numbers are dropping across the country. Slobs and crooks will always be just that. The vast majority of people participating in this program will be trying to teach their kids, about life, death, woodsmanship, the outdoors, game laws, and wildlife conservation.
twodot
New member
Buzz thank you, I am hoping that Drath will chime in here with some further elaboration about what happened in the 100 unit.
But,... I still maintain that with what you are saying there is a major character flaw in a large number of Montana sportsmen. (or should we just call them poachers?)
Just because you know or knew a lot of natives in that area who would teach their kids to lie and would involve them with their own poaching activities, I ask why penalize young people who are blessed with honest law abiding parents.
Once again seems like stricter fines and a bit more diligence by law enforcement could be a start to change on localized poaching.
Top Gun, well said all around.
But,... I still maintain that with what you are saying there is a major character flaw in a large number of Montana sportsmen. (or should we just call them poachers?)
Just because you know or knew a lot of natives in that area who would teach their kids to lie and would involve them with their own poaching activities, I ask why penalize young people who are blessed with honest law abiding parents.
Once again seems like stricter fines and a bit more diligence by law enforcement could be a start to change on localized poaching.
Top Gun, well said all around.
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