Here was a public land issue from last year.....

[Buckjump]

Looks like your user name says it all.

 

[theat]

Welcome to the forum. Great start too...not many can insult two guys before they get to four posts

 

[Buckjump]

This thread is an insult, anybody that thinks it's ok to shoulder a rifle and point it at someone for supposedly bumpin a bunch of elk has a problem themselves. As for the gay crack, why should I give him any respect?

 

[SFC B]

Looks like your user name says it all.

I hope you aren't making a crack about my service to our country. It is true that while you have been paid to work for ranchers I have been to two wars on the PUBLIC's behalf and in service to protect all of our rights. "Who knows what they were doing", seriously? You should really give the justification a rest. I am not, nor want to be anyone's judge. I am glad I wasn't in the situation.

All of us know and make peace with the possiblity of another hunter coming through our set up or crossing paths with us. It is public land and we share. I hunt for elk and deer, I don't have a "set up to harvest" like your private land rancher buddies and their hired hands out attempting to line their bosses pockets by misappropriating OUR public resources..

 

[Buckjump]

No crack on your sevrice, again nothing but respect!

I've rode for alot of large ranches, and all had big game of some sort on them, not all had Trespass signs on them and as long as a person respected the property and ask there was no problems. No one was ever run off any part of any public ground that these ranches encompassed. I've not seen the problems you speak of on any of the places I've worked on. The problems I've seen worked the other way. The "set ups" I speak of are all on public land.

 

[Hem]

IMO pointing a rifle at somebody with intent is bad trouble, nothing warrants that.I've had guys scope me and that is enough to raise hackles.Duke it out, or walk away, but bearing down on someone should put you in the lock-up.

 

[Devil Diver Down]

Looks like your user name says it all.

Looks like your edit says you are a little unsure of yourself, cowpoke.

 

[Buckjump]

A little insecure about your sexuallity. If you want to trade insults fire away, after all you're the one that likes to pull your weapon.

 

[Jwill]

Cabin fever is alive and well here at Hunttalk.

I was taught that you don't point a weapon at anything you don't intend to kill, period. No elk is worth drawing down on somebody.

 

[Devil Diver Down]

Not sure where you think I was insulting you, unless of course you were one of the 4 hands (allegedly) riding herd on elk. If it's a matter of you taking up sides with anyone from a ranch, no matter what... well, I can't help you out with that endeavor. You're going to buy more than your share of fights if that's your attitude. Certainly your choice.

As far as me being "the one that likes to pull (my) weapon," maybe you have a reading deficiency as I posted "The hunter with rifle shouldered over reacted, no question" and would never draw down on someone for such.

Plenty secure in my sexuality, Buckjump. But thanks for inquiring.

You seem a little fussy and sensitive, why not try some

 

[SFC B]

Cabin fever is alive and well here at Hunttalk.

I was taught that you don't point a weapon at anything you don't intend to kill, period. No elk is worth drawing down on somebody.

For clarity, and not that it makes it safe, but the hunter had his rifle pointed in a manner to threaten the horse(that was what his statement about walking was getting at). Again, I am not saying this was right or safe but I am glad that I was not in that position. How dangerous is it (besides the criminal and ethical problems with the herding of elk) to ride horses through a wooded hunting area amongst elk?
The fact that we are even having this discussion is the problem. That there are such unscrupulous, greedy and criminal ranchers out there and that we are subsizing them with public resources is disheartening. Maybe a couple of portions would be (as stated earlier) requiring that all livestock be on private land prior to the start of hunting season and that any rancher found to be involved in such activity as wildlife herding or harrasment be required to pay fines similar to those paid by poachers that take big game animals. Also, first offense and you lose you ability to run or lease any sort of outfitting business on your land, lose all landowner tags permanently and lose the ability to graze on public lands.
I have lived in CO for four years and this was the first season I have been able to hunt between not being able to draw tags and being deployed twice. The priviledges that ranchers are given at the expense of the general public are ridiculous. Maybe if there were some of these penalties for violations it would curb the behavior and avoid situations like this altogether.

 

[Buckjump]

Then you don't understand ranching, when "The Rancher" has livestock on public allotments, which for most will run into fall, most are required to have a rider or riders out take'in care of the livestock, absolutly nothing illegal or greedy about riding on the mountain during fall hunts. I get it that you hate ranchers in general but there is little that is illeagal about what they do in the fall. And just to keep things straight you shoot my horse out from under me you better go ahead and shoot me to and you better not miss. Are you going to shoot every Elmer Fudd that decides to have a deer or elk drive with their buddies that screws with your hunt. No probably not because the hunter is always right an the "rancher is always in the wrong. By the way if you're on the mountain with your Elmer Fudd hat on and don't point your gun at me or someone like me (and hunting as a non-rez in my case) and ask a few questions and maybe offer me a Pamprin as I might have a headache, and the fact that I've spent several months on the mountain herding elk around I might just tell you about a setup or two to help you along with your hunt. And maybe, just maybe if you give me 2 Pamprins for my head ache I'd have time of an evening to throw a pack saddle on a horse if he's not dead and help with getting your elk out, provided my headache 's gone, ya know how us cowpokes are. Been done on several occasions.

"sink major time/ money/energy into a hunt is no justification to shoulder your rifle at man or horse. I'm not up to date on posting pictures but I'll take the Pamprin for a box of my wifes Kotexes!

 

[SFC B]

1. I don't "hate" ranchers. I think the current regulations and laws GIVE them way too much at the expense of we the taxpayers for far little in return. And you, as someone who extols the virtues of ranchers that do the right thing should be even more upset when part of YOUR community does the wrong thing and brings exposure like this.
2. There were NO LIVESTOCK anywhere in the entire area and all of the cattle sign was long dried up. There hadn't been any cattle in that area for at least a few weeks. Absolutely no legitimate reason for them to be there, let alone what they were doing.
3. As for folks screwing with my hunt...if it is just a case of overlaping hunting areas, bad tactics, ignorance etc, that comes with public land and we have to deal with it. I would take that opportunity to meet those folks and try to help them be better in the woods. If you are talking about someone who is purposely trying to foul my hunt or scare animals away from the area I am in, we will have words. I would never shoot or draw down on anyone over hunting but an involved discussion and wall to wall counseling are not out of the question.
4. As for getting assistance from ranchers, that would surely be nice. I can tell you that I treat everyone as they come to me. If you are cordial, friendly and respectful that is what you will get in at least equal terms. Act a fool and your results will vary. In the situation we are discussing here and where ranchers and their outfitting businesses are competing for wildlife I would be VERY surprised to see them give up their time or resources. It would be nice and I ASSURE you that I would be the first one to post such and sing that ranches praises to everyone I knew. I value folks that give of themselves greatly.

5. I have no dog in the "pamprin" fight....perosnally the Army keeps me on 800mg Motrins, it fixes anything

 

[Zach]

I have a good idea what ranch your talking about

Hahahahaha....Is it where I'm thinking it is?

 

[Buckjump]

This whole scenerio plays out every year, so this one situation plays out every year. There are many transgressions that play out as well from so called sportsmen every year as well against ranchers, that are well documented, most times that can't be proven, that cost ranchers thousands, but which most sportsmen seem to be justified in because the rancher is somehow stealing from them. I see nothing wrong with livestock being grazed on public land and for that matter livestock numbers are down over 50% on public grazing allotments in this area and yet wildlife numbers especially muledeer are way down, where thousands of sheep use to run now there are only 2 bands if that every year. In the area I live and hunt there are millions of acres of public land to hunt and millions of acres of land that doesn't see a cow or a sheep during the whole year, why in these cases are you worried about private land even if in some cases it's large by private holding standards but small compared to public land holdings, this is not the east or the mid-west. I know of areas that have vurtually no livestock run on public land with very low big game numbers not worth the time or money unless you're into camping. We'll have to agree to disagree on public land grazing as I have little problem with it. Seems to me sportsmen get a pretty good deal to chase big game around on public land for little to nothing. Sportsmen pay a lic and tag fee to Fish and wildlife and most pay little per hunter in the way of taxes to manage public land, in fact a fair % don't pay any taxes for that purpose, besides that they pay nothing to the BLM or Forest service for the privilege to hunt public land.
I do look at and see it from both sides of the fence as I'm a public land hunter myself(DIY god I hate that term as a huge majority of hunters have absolutly no idea what its like to do it all yourself) most of what I've experienced has been the absolute opposite!

 

[RobG]

back to the original topic if that is permissible - I know tons of people who set up drives for deer and I don't think there is anything illegal about it for elk. The only thing you could do is get in front of the riders and get yerself an elk, and maybe scare them away from the private.

 

[SFC B]

back to the original topic if that is permissible - I know tons of people who set up drives for deer and I don't think there is anything illegal about it for elk. The only thing you could do is get in front of the riders and get yerself an elk, and maybe scare them away from the private.

Here is the applicable law from the DOW regulations brochure:

 

[SFC B]

Hahahahaha....Is it where I'm thinking it is?

Zach if you pm me I can let you know :hump:

 

[Buckjump]

Here is the applicable law from the DOW regulations brochure:

This happens every day during todays hunting seasons, with hunter on hunter violations, cops better get on the job.

 

[Topgun 30-06]

Funny how so many people get into internet squabbles on stuff when nobody was there to even know the circumstances of what actually happened! I can tell you one thing though and that's in 60 years of hunting I don't think the major rule that you don't point a weapon at anything you don't intend to shoot has changed! If the guy did that, whether it was at the horse or rider, IMHO he was violating more than what maybe the riders were doing or not doing that day.