Should 17 year old apply for big three?

[Csimonds]

Hello people of hunt talk, I am a 17 year old NJ resident who has just gotten into western hunting after a few years of whitetail hunting in New Jersey. I’ve decided that in my lifetime, I would love the opportunity to hunt some kind of sheep, preferably dall or Rocky Mountain, and a moose, preferably in Maine (a mountain goat would be cool also but not a top priority). After doing some research on how to apply, as I’m very new to the application system because there’s nothing I really apply for in NJ. I had a few questions that maybe someone could help me out with
1. Is it best to start applying now as an 17 year old and wait for like 30 years? Or should I just save up?
2. If it is the right move to apply, where? I’m not married to Maine for moose to example, I’d rather apply wherever is best
3. If I shouldn’t apply, should I just start saving up now?

I also am wondering about the same questions for caribou and Roosevelt elk, but I can bring those questions to other forums.
Thanks!

 

[MThuntr]

1. Is it best to start applying now as an 17 year old and wait for like 30 years? Or should I just save up?
2. If it is the right move to apply, where? I’m not married to Maine for moose to example, I’d rather apply wherever is best
3. If I shouldn’t apply, should I just start saving up now?

1) statistically you're at a major disadvantage not living in the state or province you want to hunt but starting now is better than in 2 years. Start saving because you may save enough to hunt with a guide before your odds of drawing a DIY. I'd probably suggest dipping your toes into something a bit easier while applying...you may find that logistics, costs, etc exceed your ability or desire to hunt especially if you don't have connections in the states you want to hunt. Yes there are examples in some threads on this forum of people shitting the bed (shanking the tent) when it comes to tough hunts.
2) that's very conditional based on if you just want to hunt or if you want a trophy and I'm not sure anyone will "the best is X unit" especially online...that's your job to search out with the hundreds of resources available to you
3) Save $ while applying acknowledging guided hunts can be exceedingly expensive and will only get more expensive.

The same answers apply to caribou and elk.

 

[BrowningCitori]

Step one, yes apply. Step two, find a career you like that pays a lot of money! A LOT, it will be easier to hunt these species if you have money. Sad but true

 

[The Hedgehog]

NO. 17, 18, 28, 50, 70, none of those ages or any in-between should be applying.

 

[cgasner1]

Bill Christy 2.0 calling it now

 

[Addicting]

Do what you want with your money. I apply in specific areas. However it should be know that each year it is diminishing returns on investment. You also need to be prepared that it can all go up in smoke one day and you’re left holding a smoldering bag of crap.

As a NR you are at the mercy of whatever the States legislature decides to do and it varies every year. NR never win in the end as wild life is held in trust for the residents.

If you took money and invested it in a mutual fund and just planned on hunting Alaska in 10 years you would be further ahead.

 

[brymoore]

I agree with the former Greenhorn.

However, if you are going to apply irregardless, do it now.

Although, based on odds of success, your sheep funds might be better spent on sheep raffle tags - apply to all of them.

 

[Gerald Martin]

For moose, consider saving up and hunting in Newfoundland.

 

[sneakem]

Move to AK... hunt all 3... smartest thing you'll ever do...

 

[Gr8bawana]

Hello people of hunt talk, I am a 17 year old NJ resident who has just gotten into western hunting after a few years of whitetail hunting in New Jersey. I’ve decided that in my lifetime, I would love the opportunity to hunt some kind of sheep, preferably dall or Rocky Mountain, and a moose, preferably in Maine (a mountain goat would be cool also but not a top priority). After doing some research on how to apply, as I’m very new to the application system because there’s nothing I really apply for in NJ. I had a few questions that maybe someone could help me out with
1. Is it best to start applying now as an 17 year old and wait for like 30 years? Or should I just save up?
2. If it is the right move to apply, where? I’m not married to Maine for moose to example, I’d rather apply wherever is best
3. If I shouldn’t apply, should I just start saving up now?

I also am wondering about the same questions for caribou and Roosevelt elk, but I can bring those questions to other forums.
Thanks!

Whatever you do, make sure you don't read any of Zim's rants about starting out now.

 

[ismith]

Become a feudal warlord first. Then the world is your oyster.

 

[buckbull]

Your best bet is to save money and buy a hunt in Canada or wherever you want. Money talks, always will.

 

[idelkslayer]

Hello people of hunt talk, I am a 17 year old NJ resident who has just gotten into western hunting after a few years of whitetail hunting in New Jersey. I’ve decided that in my lifetime, I would love the opportunity to hunt some kind of sheep, preferably dall or Rocky Mountain, and a moose, preferably in Maine (a mountain goat would be cool also but not a top priority). After doing some research on how to apply, as I’m very new to the application system because there’s nothing I really apply for in NJ. I had a few questions that maybe someone could help me out with
1. Is it best to start applying now as an 17 year old and wait for like 30 years? Or should I just save up?
2. If it is the right move to apply, where? I’m not married to Maine for moose to example, I’d rather apply wherever is best
3. If I shouldn’t apply, should I just start saving up now?

I also am wondering about the same questions for caribou and Roosevelt elk, but I can bring those questions to other forums.
Thanks!

If you are going to start, the sooner the better. However, there are a lot of reasons why you shouldn't bother.

Look up the nonresident drawing odds for the species that interest you and the states that offer non resident tags. If you are comfortable with throwing several hundred dollars each year at less than 1% odds then start applying.

Take sheep for example. In Wyoming alone, at $150 dollars per year for a point in the draw and many decades required to get to the front of the line, you will spend $1,500 per decade at the current price which is sure to go up such that by the time you are 50 years old you will have spent a minimum of $5,000 and pay $3,000 dollars for the tag if you are lucky enough to draw, on what will still be 1% odds of drawing a tag. For more perspective on Wyoming, it will take you 30 years to get to the front of the line with the current preference point system. There will be at least 1,000 other people at your point level still competing for a handful of tags (17 tags last year) So best case scenario when you are 50 years old you will have a 1.7% chance at drawing a tag.

In Idaho, the draw is random (no points) but you will be required to buy a nonresident hunting license and application fee at a non refundable cost of $185 and $45 dollars respectively, $230 total. Again your drawing odds will be less than 1% and your cost at current rates will be a minimum of $2,300 per decade and then if you are lucky enough to draw you will spend $2,600 dollars on the tag. Only you can decide if that is a good use of your money. Let's say that you apply in Idaho for 25 years and none of the tag or fees increase and lightning strikes and you draw a tag. You will have spent spend $8,386 on applications, licenses and tag fees. Then you will spend money on travel, food, and equipment. You will easily be over $10,000 for the opportunity. That's a great deal on a sheep hunt, if you draw, but the odds are that you never will and instead you spent $5,750 dollars in applications in 25 years that you could have invested into buying hunts in Alaska, Canada, or Mexico.

So if you applied in just Idaho and Wyoming you would spend nearly $4,000 every 10 years on a tag that you have almost no statistical chance of drawing.

You have to weigh those options against saving for the hunts you want to do. DIY moose and caribou in Alaska is still an option for now and your cheapest option. Dall sheep will cost several ten thousands of dollars at todays price. You will need to make good money be disciplined to save up at a fast enough rate to catch future sheep prices.

If I was in your shoes, I'd save money to fund a sheep hunt in a decade. Make sure you marry a woman who respects your goal and won't throw a fit when you drop 50K on your Dall sheep hunt 10 years from now.

 

[Desk Pop]

I started applying at age 18 as a Missouri kid with some dreams. I'm 40 now, moved out west for the hunting and public land and have been happy with my choice to spend money in draws. The draws are expensive and the odds keep getting worse, but a lot of the old timers discouraging kids from getting in the draw game do so to better their own odds. If you're playing the long game, they'll be gone and out of the points game and life game by the time you (may) draw a ram or bull moose tag.

I would consider trying for ewe or cow moose as a shorter term type of goal that is a huge possibility after a couple years of point gathering.

 

[Bowhuntrben]

Are you OK with cow moose? If so, yes, apply. Colorado has realistic draw odds.

Outside of cow moose, I wouldn't waste my money on any state with a points system. Save your money and just buy a hunt some day. Or go to Alaska, but I'm guessing that's likely not a super cheap option even if you DIY.

If you do want to apply, do it in states that are cheap to apply in or states where it is completely random (Idaho).

 

[MTGunner]

Csimonds, you are young and frankly I would start applying and buying bonus points. Yes, saving for a guided hunt is a good idea also. Put your money in CD’s and leave them alone to build. Who knows how long a big three tag could come available for a eastern nonresident. What have you got to loose. Hope this give you something to digest. MTG

 

[Csimonds]

I agree with the former Greenhorn.

However, if you are going to apply irregardless, do it now.

Although, based on odds of success, your sheep funds might be better spent on sheep raffle tags - apply to all of them.

If you are going to start, the sooner the better. However, there are a lot of reasons why you shouldn't bother.

Look up the nonresident drawing odds for the species that interest you and the states that offer non resident tags. If you are comfortable with throwing several hundred dollars each year at less than 1% odds then start applying.

Take sheep for example. In Wyoming alone, at $150 dollars per year for a point in the draw and many decades required to get to the front of the line, you will spend $1,500 per decade at the current price which is sure to go up such that by the time you are 50 years old you will have spent a minimum of $5,000 and pay $3,000 dollars for the tag if you are lucky enough to draw, on what will still be 1% odds of drawing a tag. For more perspective on Wyoming, it will take you 30 years to get to the front of the line with the current preference point system. There will be at least 1,000 other people at your point level still competing for a handful of tags (17 tags last year) So best case scenario when you are 50 years old you will have a 1.7% chance at drawing a tag.

In Idaho, the draw is random (no points) but you will be required to buy a nonresident hunting license and application fee at a non refundable cost of $185 and $45 dollars respectively, $230 total. Again your drawing odds will be less than 1% and your cost at current rates will be a minimum of $2,300 per decade and then if you are lucky enough to draw you will spend $2,600 dollars on the tag. Only you can decide if that is a good use of your money. Let's say that you apply in Idaho for 25 years and none of the tag or fees increase and lightning strikes and you draw a tag. You will have spent spend $8,386 on applications, licenses and tag fees. Then you will spend money on travel, food, and equipment. You will easily be over $10,000 for the opportunity. That's a great deal on a sheep hunt, if you draw, but the odds are that you never will and instead you spent $5,750 dollars in applications in 25 years that you could have invested into buying hunts in Alaska, Canada, or Mexico.

So if you applied in just Idaho and Wyoming you would spend nearly $4,000 every 10 years on a tag that you have almost no statistical chance of drawing.

You have to weigh those options against saving for the hunts you want to do. DIY moose and caribou in Alaska is still an option for now and your cheapest option. Dall sheep will cost several ten thousands of dollars at todays price. You will need to make good money be disciplined to save up at a fast enough rate to catch future sheep prices.

If I was in your shoes, I'd save money to fund a sheep hunt in a decade. Make sure you marry a woman who respects your goal and won't throw a fit when you drop 50K on your Dall sheep hunt 10 years from now.

Thank you so much for the info. When you say DIY Alaska for caribou and moose, does that mean I should be applying in Alaska for those animals?

 

[Csimonds]

If you are going to start, the sooner the better. However, there are a lot of reasons why you shouldn't bother.

Look up the nonresident drawing odds for the species that interest you and the states that offer non resident tags. If you are comfortable with throwing several hundred dollars each year at less than 1% odds then start applying.

Take sheep for example. In Wyoming alone, at $150 dollars per year for a point in the draw and many decades required to get to the front of the line, you will spend $1,500 per decade at the current price which is sure to go up such that by the time you are 50 years old you will have spent a minimum of $5,000 and pay $3,000 dollars for the tag if you are lucky enough to draw, on what will still be 1% odds of drawing a tag. For more perspective on Wyoming, it will take you 30 years to get to the front of the line with the current preference point system. There will be at least 1,000 other people at your point level still competing for a handful of tags (17 tags last year) So best case scenario when you are 50 years old you will have a 1.7% chance at drawing a tag.

In Idaho, the draw is random (no points) but you will be required to buy a nonresident hunting license and application fee at a non refundable cost of $185 and $45 dollars respectively, $230 total. Again your drawing odds will be less than 1% and your cost at current rates will be a minimum of $2,300 per decade and then if you are lucky enough to draw you will spend $2,600 dollars on the tag. Only you can decide if that is a good use of your money. Let's say that you apply in Idaho for 25 years and none of the tag or fees increase and lightning strikes and you draw a tag. You will have spent spend $8,386 on applications, licenses and tag fees. Then you will spend money on travel, food, and equipment. You will easily be over $10,000 for the opportunity. That's a great deal on a sheep hunt, if you draw, but the odds are that you never will and instead you spent $5,750 dollars in applications in 25 years that you could have invested into buying hunts in Alaska, Canada, or Mexico.

So if you applied in just Idaho and Wyoming you would spend nearly $4,000 every 10 years on a tag that you have almost no statistical chance of drawing.

You have to weigh those options against saving for the hunts you want to do. DIY moose and caribou in Alaska is still an option for now and your cheapest option. Dall sheep will cost several ten thousands of dollars at todays price. You will need to make good money be disciplined to save up at a fast enough rate to catch future sheep prices.

If I was in your shoes, I'd save money to fund a sheep hunt in a decade. Make sure you marry a woman who respects your goal and won't throw a fit when you drop 50K on your Dall sheep hunt 10 years from now.

Also, even after 30 years of getting points, I would still have such low odds?

 

[brownbear932008]

Also, even after 30 years of getting points, I would still have such low odds?

Yes and realistically probably worse. It's a diminishing return as someone already said. Tag numbers continue to drop and cost continue to go up. I had big dreams as well 30 years ago. Still no end in sight at 50. Think long and hard before you jump into Western hunting at this point. It's a money game plain and simple. I'm guessing Wyoming isn't decades but lifetimes away for new point holders as it stands today.

 

[idelkslayer]

Thank you so much for the info. When you say DIY Alaska for caribou and moose, does that mean I should be applying in Alaska for those animals?

Those can be done with over-the-counter tags, OTC. No drawing necessary. The big costs there are going to be logistical including bush plane flights.