Caribou Gear

WILD BISON ON THE MONTANA PRAIRIE? MAYBE. BUT WHAT IS WILD? by Ron Moody

While I understand the motivations of APR to put bison on their landscape and applaud what they have done, it is still private land and a private domestic herd. This was part of the anti-bison bills submitted this legislative session, was that once those bison were declared livestock, they could never be released to the wild under a wildlife heading. If I had that land and money I might do that as well. But, APR is not a substitute for restoring a native wildlife species back into Montana on public lands.

Take a good look at that map that Nemont posted. Look at the space for the green NWR CMR, the pink public land, the spring green National Monument land, all of which wildlife bison can be introduced on. APR has stated if Montana did this, they would open their borders to allow the herds to mix (better for genetics) and that increases the land the bison can be on. If there are white private areas that dont want any bison, Montana is a fence out state and those small parcels nearby that checkerboard can be fenced and there are NGO's that have offered to pay for fencing to help mitigate the conflicts.

With that said, here is some info from APR's site involving statements made on this thread about APR.

Public Hunting Access
"Yes. For five years now, we have been participants in the Montana Department of Fish, Wildlife & Parks’ Block Management Program. Block Management is a cooperative program that creates public access on private lands by opening them up to hunting. In 2010, we enrolled 17,386 acres of our property, in 2011 we committed to enrolling 28,000 acres for the next decade, and in 2012 we purchased an additional 18,000 acres that will remain open to public hunting. We also intend to continue to increase acreage over time. On average we provide more than 1,200 hunter days of recreation each year. Hunting is also available on the 215,000 acres of public land on which APR has grazing privileges. This area is cooperatively managed for public hunting by Montana Fish, Wildlife & Parks and the Bureau of Land Management. For more information about hunting on our properties, please see the Region 6 FWP Block Management Book."

Economics
"We expect over time that the assembly of American Prairie Reserve will significantly increase expenditures on outdoor recreation, education programs and science research in the region. This will result in an influx of revenues for motels, restaurants, caterers, sporting goods stores, gas stations, outfitters and others who service these visitors and programs. As demonstrated elsewhere in the American West and many other places around the world, restoration of large natural areas and the resulting recreational opportunities help local communities attract and retain people, from retirees to young business professionals and entrepreneurs. APR is already contributing significantly to the regional economy through its daily operations. Since our inception in 2001, APR’s expenditures in the six-county region total more than $19 million, including land purchases, wages paid to local staff, tourism activities, equipment and supply purchases, payments to local contractors and real estate taxes."

Taxes
"APR pays real estate property taxes on all of its deeded lands, which currently comprise about 59,000 acres, like any other private landowner. Public charities in the state of Montana, like APR, can apply for exemption from paying real estate property taxes on no more than 160 acres and are required to pay real estate property taxes on all lands owned in excess of that acreage. APR has not applied for that exemption. APR also pays taxes on personal property including our bison and other taxable personal property."

Ranching Affected
"People are often surprised to learn that every seller with whom APR has done business is still in the ranching business and 95% of them still reside in the local area. No displacement of ranching has occurred to date. Like any neighborhood, land ownership in the region is constantly shifting. Many of the properties we’ve purchased have been bought and sold three or four times in the past two decades. Ranchers may sell their land for a variety of reasons, such as a desire to purchase new grazing pastures, a need to consolidate their herds, or a decision to move their cattle operation to another part of Montana or out of state. In the six-county area in which we are working, there are recorded 441,000 head of cattle. In just Phillips County alone, where APR has most of its land holdings, cattle numbers have increased from 80,000 head to 88,000 head in the six years since APR has owned land. When complete, American Prairie Reserve will likely be a relatively small island in a vast sea of agriculture in northeastern Montana."
 
Economics
"We expect over time that the assembly of American Prairie Reserve will significantly increase expenditures on outdoor recreation, education programs and science research in the region. This will result in an influx of revenues for motels, restaurants, caterers, sporting goods stores, gas stations, outfitters and others who service these visitors and programs. As demonstrated elsewhere in the American West and many other places around the world, restoration of large natural areas and the resulting recreational opportunities help local communities attract and retain people, from retirees to young business professionals and entrepreneurs. APR is already contributing significantly to the regional economy through its daily operations. Since our inception in 2001, APR’s expenditures in the six-county region total more than $19 million, including land purchases, wages paid to local staff, tourism activities, equipment and supply purchases, payments to local contractors and real estate taxes."

."


Ever been to Val Marie, Sask.? They were promised this very same thing when the Grassland National Park was formed. None of the promised revenue have appeared so I would take the promise of economic revival from the APR with a very big grain of salt.

Nemont
 
Ever been to Val Marie, Sask.? They were promised this very same thing when the Grassland National Park was formed. None of the promised revenue have appeared so I would take the promise of economic revival from the APR with a very big grain of salt.

Nemont

Maybe if there were Bison in that Park the people would come. What's missing?
 
Big Horn sheep, elk, deer, antelope, bison, Missouri River ... 'just a few of the attractions in the APR neighborhood.

Seems to me that there were already many people who came and enjoyed those attractions prior to advent of the APR. Maybe the APR has added .05% more people but that is highly doubtful.

Maybe if there were Bison in that Park the people would come. What's missing?

People are missing. So you are telling me that bison are a big enough draw to risk getting stuck on a gumbo road out in nowhere South Phillips County to enough people to grow our economy? Hard see how burger flippers and hotel maids make enough to power economic growth.

We are not Yellowstone or Glacier and I highly doubt bison are going to attract many city dwellers to the prairie to be bit by mosquitoes and horse flies in the middle of the summer. Winter travel isn't even a option for most sane people because the bulk of those roads are not bus routes and don't get plowed. So we have about three months a year that would be ideal for people to come out and maybe see bison. The APR plans to keep and house most of those people on their ranches not in town. They are not going to drive in 60 or 70 miles over gravel roads at the end of the day to grab a burger and a beer.

I am not against bison but to say that bison are going to be our economic growth engine for North East and Central Montana is a fantasy.

We would get more tax revenue from just the section of the KeyStone XL pipeline that runs through Valley Country in a year, than the APR would produce in 10 years.

Nemont
 
We would get more tax revenue from just the section of the KeyStone XL pipeline that runs through Valley Country in a year, than the APR would produce in 10 years.
Now there's something we should all get together and support, rather than debating over a few wild tatonkas in a few scattered spots across Montana.
 
Now there's something we should all get together and support, rather than debating over a few wild tatonkas in a few scattered spots across Montana.

Just saying that if we are going to base our decisions on economics then everything that has a positive economic impact should be considered.

Why would you support the APR and Bison based on a very small economic impact on the region and not support something that has a huge impact on our economy?

Why do we have to consider the economic benefits of the APR and Bison but not the Keystone XL pipeline?



Nemont
 
The difference is that the Keystone XL pipeline is ALL about economic gain ... that's all.
Whereas the economic aspect of bison reintroduction is but a minor consideration.
 
Whereas the economic aspect of bison reintroduction is but a minor consideration.

That isn't the way it is being sold by the APR and Buffalo hippies up here. To listen to them wild bison will lead to a massive new source of tourist. Even though the roads that would lead to this "isolated wild herd" are impassable much of the time.

Nemont
 
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I agree with your realism. 'Doubt that it will result in a significant new source of tourism ... unless they build several Buffalo Bar, Grille, & Casino facilities with motel accomodations near the hardscape highway.
 
Buffalo hippies up here.
WTF is a "Buffalo hippie? A nappy dreads bison?

P0l8G17.jpg


I know three piece suit wearing wild bison advocates; flat assed Levi jean, western shirt and cowboy boot wearing bison advocates; and everything in between. Wild bison restoration advocates are from all over the world, numerous ethnicities, diverse economic, educational, occupational and political backgrounds.

Or maybe you are referring to the free love, sex in the wild, non missionary position hippie buffalo?

wpnTWAY.jpg
 
WTF is a "Buffalo hippie?

I know three piece suit wearing wild bison advocates; flat assed Levi jean, western shirt and cowboy boot wearing bison advocates; and everything in between. Wild bison restoration advocates are from all over the world, numerous ethnicities, diverse economic, educational, occupational and political backgrounds.

Hit a nerve?

Why would the term Buffalo hippie offend anyone?

Nemont
 
It may never rival Glacier or Yellowstone in terms of numbers of folks visiting, but it would help diversify the economy and help keep people in the region longer than a fill-up before getting to East Glacier. Increase your tourist traffic 20% and it's still good economic development.

Remember. At one time. The same argument was used against Yellowstone. Folks couldn't fathom going all that way to look at hot water and grass.

APR also is helping young ranchers get established without having to get a loan to buy a spread. The run livestock on APR deeded and BLM.
 
It may never rival Glacier or Yellowstone in terms of numbers of folks visiting, but it would help diversify the economy and help keep people in the region longer than a fill-up before getting to East Glacier. Increase your tourist traffic 20% and it's still good economic development.

Remember. At one time. The same argument was used against Yellowstone. Folks couldn't fathom going all that way to look at hot water and grass.

APR also is helping young ranchers get established without having to get a loan to buy a spread. The run livestock on APR deeded and BLM.

NEARLY all of our tourist traffic occurs during hunting season. The summer tourists are usually either fisherman or boaters.

Unless they build a viewing area like Slippery Ann has for the elk and keep the bison in view, I can't see anywhere near a 20% increase our tourist numbers. To see a huge drop all we need to have again is a few dry years and for the Corps to drain the lake again.

The oilfield guys are filling up the rooms anyway do I am not sure where the tourist will stay except out on the APR.

Curious about these young ranchers that the APR is getting started. If that is accurate how come they don't make that info public? That has not been included in any of the stuff I have seen from them. Not saying it isn't happening just wondering why they aren't promoting that angle to the locals.



Nemont
 
I don't think APR has been very vocal inside of MT on anything, unfortunately. Their operations budget is $1 million/year. They employee around 6-8 people and lease ranches they purchased back to the owner or to new folks.

I think they should be telling that story, rather than let others define them. But local sentiment is such that The whole scene reminds me of when Sheriff Bart arrives in Rock Ridge. They may get a pie in the window now and again, but everyone still calls them dirty names in the daylight.
 
ben, the bison, just like the Native Americans, went south out of the northern plains....just like the antelope, mule deer....migration was a natural part of their survival....certainly said shaggies are more suitable to winter than cattle....bison face storms, the Almighty built them w/ lotsa "fur" on their face to take the wind....but they did not stay in Southern Canada or NE Montana....they went south...why do you think that the Missouri River is littered w/ bison bones at certain crossings? shaggies migrated north in the spring, south in the winter.

to the moron who suggested that my worries are about financial impacts...good grief.. I would find a way to capitalize off the bison if they are forced upon us.... i'd put up a train track around Phillips/Valley County, get me an Engineer's cap, put out some "wild injuns" and sell train tours to the unsuspecting.
 
Eric,

Thanks for the response. I'm 4 vodka tonics into a thursday but will answer in kind tomorrow.
 
the natives migrated in the winter time from Southern Sask & NE Mt. to the "greasy grass", in Southern Mt...most of the buffalo did the same...which is why we can still see the trails from 10's of 1000's of bison in the hillsides, and bones by the 1000's in the river crossings...must have been a sight to see 5000 shaggies crossing the "Mighty Mo"...trailing to calving grounds and summer range.
 
Eric,

That might have been the case when there were no fences, dams or other impediments, back when the west was young. It's certainly not the case now with wild herds in the Grasslands of Canada, with wood bison and if you look at the migration of the Yellowstone bison, they are contained. Tribal bison aren't busting out of their pastures to run 300 miles down state, where the weather can be just as drastic as on the highline. Yellowstone Bison would migrate down to lower levels because the feed is easier, but there are still many winters where bison stay in the park year round. I think if they can survive and thrive in that winter environment, the High Line wouldn't be a death knell to them. I'd also point out that during the horrific blizzard that just killed a ton of cows, bison came through it unscathed for the most part. They've evolved to handle those winters.

Plus, that narrative completely discounts the fact that MCA 87-1-216 clearly states that any wild bison trans-location must have a containment plan in place to ensure that bison do not leave the designated area. http://leg.mt.gov/bills/2011/billpdf/SB0212.pdf

Just like they do with the Henry's herd.
 
If they are contained to a specific area, how can they be classified as wild, free roaming? Not being a smart @ss just don't quite get the difference.

Nemont

PS the tribal bison have tons of hay thrown to them in the winter.
 
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