Why the Left May Lose.

[Nemont]

This cartoon by Ted Rall, seen below, was pulled from MSNBC.com. Whether you agree with the war or not it is propaganda like this that makes the political left look like they hate America. I am all for healthy debate in my mind this cross the line. The guy did what you thought was right for his country and paid the ultimate price whether you view him as a hero or not the man still has a family who are having to see crap like this. I understand the cartoonist has a right to his political opinions but he should be a little more subtle.

Why we pulled Monday's Ted Rall cartoon
Item did not meet MSNBC standards of fairness and tasteMSNBC.com pulled a cartoon by syndicated political cartoonist Ted Rall on Monday.

Rall’s cartoon, distributed widely by United Press Syndicate to scores of newspapers and Web sites, concerned the late Pat Tillman, the NFL player who quit football to join the Army. Tillman was killed last month in Afghanistan.

The cartoon, like others on MSNBC.com, is published daily on the site via an automated syndication feed. Such feeds are rarely reviewed. However, MSNBC.com Editor in chief Dean Wright concluded Monday’s Rall item did not meet MSNBC.com standards of fairness and taste.

Nemont

 

[Whiskers]

Hopefully the left will loose. Could you imagine if the GOP would put out a cartoon about a man that lost his life. ASSHOLES.

 

[BuzzH]

Nemont,

I agree with you, that cartoon does cross the line, very poor taste.

Equally as bad, is the wreckless and casual attitude the Bush administration puts on their propoganda and pure BS for the justification of the Iraq war, also crosses the line and shows some pretty poor taste...

The toughest thing for me to understand is how the American public has become so accustomed to being lied to, they dont think its a big deal. Totally unbelievable.

 

[1_pointer]

The toughest thing for me to understand is how the American public has become so accustomed to being lied to, they dont think its a big deal.

That's quite a sad description of current American society, yet rings with a bit of truth.

 

[feclnogn]

Aint the 1st amendment great. To bad dipshits like this forget that guys like Tillman are what guarantees him the right to be a dipshit.

 

[Nemont]

Equally as bad, is the wreckless and casual attitude the Bush administration puts on their propoganda and pure BS for the justification of the Iraq war, also crosses the line and shows some pretty poor taste...

I am sorry Buzz but to equate the two just doesn't make sense to me. The war in Iraq was a political decision. Expand a little on your premise here. I willing to listen but just don't see any connection.

Nemont

 

[BuzzH]

What?

I find it odd that you would run down a single cartoonists view, while not finding any problem with the shit you're being spoon fed on a daily basis by the Bush propoganda wagon.

I agree the cartoon was tasteless and not very sensitive to a guy who was trying to do what he felt was right, as were the others who have been killed there.

Point being, what the cartoonist stated, while in about the poorest taste possible, has more truth in it than anything thats come out of Bush or his administration since the iraqi fiasco started.

Thats sad, that the American public demands no accountability in the person they freely elect to run the country they LIVE in, yet totally outraged over a cartoon.

Integrity, honesty, and accountability are so far from the reality of this administration its frightening.

 

[Nemont]

I find it odd that you would run down a single cartoonists view, while not finding any problem with the shit you're being spoon fed on a daily basis by the Bush propoganda wagon

Buzz,
I don't believe everything the current administration says.
Here is the deal this cartoon offended me personally, that is all. I feel anyone who believes or thinks this is the way the men and women of the Armed Services think simply has no experience with the Military. It is disrespectful.

I am surprised you would believe the things the media is reporting about Iraq as truth.

Point being, what the cartoonist stated, while in about the poorest taste possible, has more truth in it than anything thats come out of Bush or his administration since the iraqi fiasco started

If you think this is the truth then fine, I happen to think a little different then you, thats is all.

Do you think Sen. Kerry is using any propaganda in his campaign? Or is only Republican propaganda offensive?

Nemont

 

[ELKCHSR]

The toughest thing for me to understand is how the American public has become so accustomed to being lied to, they dont think its a big deal. Totally unbelievable.

Thats sad, that the American public demands no accountability in the person they freely elect to run the country they LIVE in, yet totally outraged over a cartoon.

Integrity, honesty, and accountability are so far from the reality of this administration its frightening.

And the last administration was even close to being better? Or the other man running for the white house right now? One thing for certain, even if the rest of what has been going on since 9/11, the terrorists have been kept so busy trying to jump out of the wood work back in their own home land wanting to meet Ahlah personally, that this country hasn't seen much terrorist activity at all. Kind of amazing I would say. Or is it that there really wasn't terrorists in the first place and this whole thing was a hoax, including the twin towers just so Bush could stay in power...
I would come up with a question, what would you have done differently that would have made this all turn out right? Besides turning the other cheek, that is what Klinton did and the twin towers finally hit the ground after the second attempt...

 

[BuzzH]

Elkchsr,

You prove my point perfectly, you dont seem to mind being lied to.

Also, refrain from making assumptions, I never implied or hinted at anyone being more or less honest than Dubya. I defend very few politicians or their actions.

That still doesnt change the fact the guy is a crooked, lying, politician.

 

[JoseCuervo]

One thing for certain, even if the rest of what has been going on since 9/11, the terrorists have been kept so busy trying to jump out of the wood work back in their own home land wanting to meet Ahlah personally, that this country hasn't seen much terrorist activity at all. Kind of amazing I would say.

Elkcheese,
Do you even understand what the word "Terrorist" means????

Since Sept 11, this country has been "terroized" daily. Have you tried riding a commercial airline flight in the last 2 years? We now have to show up extra hours early due the "War on Terror" and lose huge hours of productivity to our economy.

We now have to be careful when we go to the library, as there remains the terror of Ashcroft having us jailed.

We now spend huge amounts of wasted amounts of our GNP keeping an eye out for the terrorists. You have to be living in a hole in the ground not to think that we aren't being terrorized.

 

[FAIRCHASEBEN]

EG
True, but understand this as well ;

Since May of 2003 this country has been ''safer'' daily.

Nobody with any morals has to be careful going to a library.

We don't have to spend huge amounts of anything keeping an eye out for terrorists ; put a diaper on your head , go to jail , thats the law .

 

[JoseCuervo]

FairChase,

I am not sure what the May 2003 date is, unless it was the date that Dubya landed on the Lincoln, announcing an end to hostilities. Unfortunately, for 600 Americans in Iraq, the world became less "safer" each day...

And I disagree about the Library. We have now given Ashcroft the right to invade your privacy and your thoughts, and your education, all in the name of the Patriot Act.

I find it an interesting Paradox, that people support Dubya on the grounds of protecting the Second Ammendment, but then turn a blind eye to his trampling of the other 9 9 in the Bill of Rights....

 

[FAIRCHASEBEN]

Right about the time the Iraqi army was reduced to a bunch of stinky , filthy lunatics with AK-47's riding around in the back of a 1972 Datsun pick-up.

My privacy , My thoughts and My education cannot be 'invaded ' because I have nothing to hide !

I'm not supporting Dubya , I'm supporting Patriotism and your lack of it is pathetic.

 

[JoseCuervo]

Originally posted by FAIRCHASEBEN:

My privacy , My thoughts and My education cannot be 'invaded ' because I have nothing to hide !

Uhmmmmm, did you mean to imply that there were no thoughts to hide????

And if thinkig the Patriot Act was one of the worst pieces of legislation ever rushed through Congress and signed by a president is "pathetic", I am OK with that. I would rather be "pathetic" and free to think, than "patriotic" and not allowed to think.

Truly one of the great whacks to our Liberty.

 

[JoseCuervo]

And more "costs" of the terror, we now live in, every day.

Oil Surges to New Highs on Security Fears

By Richard Mably

LONDON (Reuters) - Oil prices surged again on Wednesday, setting fresh 13-year highs, on worries about Middle East supply security and fears for summer gasoline shortages in the United States.


U.S. light crude closed 59 cents or 1.5 percent higher at $39.57 a barrel, its highest settlement price since ending at $39.69 on Oct. 12, 1990, two months after Iraq (news - web sites) invaded Kuwait in the crisis that led to the first Gulf War (news - web sites).


The contract traded as high as $39.74, the highest since spot prices hit $39.99 on Feb. 27. 2003, in the buildup to the U.S.-led war against Iraq. It traded as low as $38.49.


In London, Brent crude settled 79 cents or 2.2 percent higher at $36.72 a barrel, also its highest settlement since October 1990. The contract peaked at $36.90 a barrel in intraday trading.


"Violence in the Middle East specifically targeting oil assets has raised the bar with regards to the fear of supply disruption," said Josh Sadler, energy analyst with Societe Generale.


An attack on Saturday by Islamic militants on foreign workers at a petrochemical plant in the Saudi Red Sea city of Yanbu followed a failed suicide bombing mission 10 days ago at Iraq's Basra oil export terminal.


Supply security concerns have drawn investment funds to oil. The Goldman Sachs commodity index (^GNX - news), heavily weighted toward energy, set an all-time high on Wednesday.


"Saudi Arabia's oil infrastructure has three major export arteries and looks as defensive as it could be to attack. However the risks have clearly risen," said oil analysts at Deutsche Bank in a report.


Weekly gasoline inventory data from the United States at first sight appeared to provide some comfort for dealers worried about a summer supply crunch at U.S. pumps. The U.S. Energy Information Administration said gasoline stocks rose four million barrels to 204 million barrels in the week to April 30, above forecasts for a 1.5-million-barrel stockbuild.


But dealers said they remained worried that inventories may not build sufficiently to meet peak summer U.S. demand.


"The question being asked is whether stockbuilds in May and June will be enough to meet demand in July and August, when everyone takes to the road for vacation, and the industry's answer at the moment is 'no'," said Refco broker Nauman Barakat.


U.S. demand for motor fuel in the United States is rising fast, buoyed by motorists favoring low-mileage-per-gallon sports utility vehicles. The EIA said consumption over the last four weeks averaged 9.1 million bpd, up 3.8 percent over the same period last year.


U.S. gasoline inventories remain 3.3 million barrels lower than a year ago and total U.S. commercial oil reserves of 299 million barrels are at an 18-million-barrel deficit versus the same time last year.


Traders have been looking to the Organization of the Petroleum Exporting Countries for signs that it might ease production limits to contain price increases.


OPEC (news - web sites) President Purnomo Yusgiantoro on Wednesday sought to soothe market concerns but declined to say whether or not the cartel is likely to raise production limits at a meeting in Beirut on June 3.


Oil also found support on Wednesday from potential supply problems in Nigeria and Georgia.


Police said hundreds of Muslims had been killed by Christian militia in ethnic fighting in the central Nigerian town of Yelwa. While Yelwa is far from the country's Niger Delta oil facilities, the violence fueled fears of a possible disruption from Africa's largest crude producer.




In Georgia, there were concerns about a disruption from the 200,000 barrel a day Black Sea Batumi export terminal. Georgian Defense Minister Gela Bezhuashvili told a local television station that the terminal, in the Adzhara region, had been mined.

Bezhuashvili did not say who had laid the explosives but rebel leader Aslan Abashidze is in control of Adzhara and its capital Batumi, in a stand-off with the Georgian government over control of the region.

 

[FAIRCHASEBEN]

Nothing implied , stated as fact ;
My thoughts cannot be 'invaded ' because I have nothing to hide , no anti-American , no pro-Iraq , no pro-terrorist , no commi-pinko bleeding heart apologists thoughts whatsoever.

The only 'thinking' the patriot act threatens is 'thinking' of ways to harm this country , so why do you feel so infringed EG ?

 

[JoseCuervo]

I guess for the same reason Congressman C.L. "Butch" Otter (R-Idaho), that great champion of individual rights, and individual freedoms has called for its' repeal.......

And what is "anti-American", and who is to judge? Should we have McCarthy and Ashcroft holding hearings on un-American activities??? That is great that Dubya has led us back to the McCarthyism..... Truly a great leader for us....

While many of the accusations lodged against the act are, in the words of the Justice Department's Mark Corallo, illustrative of some Americans' "incredible ignorance of federal law," other objections may not be so far off the mark. According to the Justice Department's recent inspector general's report to Congress, 34 credible complaints (of the more than 1,000 complaints received) of civil rights and civil liberties intrusions were reported in the six-month period ending June 15. While most of the complaints were lodged against the DoJ's Bureau of Prisons concerning the treatment of Arab and Muslim detainees, the inspector general's report also lists credible complaints registered against the Federal Bureau of Investigation, the Drug Enforcement Agency and the Immigration and Naturalization Service.

As such incidents demonstrate, one of the major shortfalls of the USA Patriot Act is its substantial (though not complete) dependency on its enforcers, namely federal law enforcement agencies, to police themselves in the law's application. Such is often the case in the enforcement of law with respect to the civil rights of citizens. It is true: the more intrusive the means of law enforcement, the greater protection a given society has against criminal activity in general and terror-related activities in particular. The question, of course, is at what price this security comes.

(Hey Fairchase, I posted some new anti Fat-Assed ATV threads....)

 

[JoseCuervo]

Areas of Popular Concern
A. Domestic Terrorism Defined
In principle, objections to the expansion of federal authority under the Patriot Act are not without merit. Indeed, as James Madison told Virginia's ratifying convention during its consideration of the present U.S. Constitution, "There are more instances of the abridgment of the freedom of the people by gradual and silent encroachments of those in power than by violent and sudden usurpations."

The greatest potential problem posed by the Patriot Act is also the most obvious: How does the Patriot Act define terrorism, and who is the arbiter of this judgment? It is almost universally agreed that the federal government must take responsibility for preventing and prosecuting acts of domestic terrorism, but the definition of "domestic terrorism" is the key. If defined too broadly, domestic terrorism could encompass crimes previously prosecuted under the protection of the civil rights guaranteed to any citizen. If what was formerly a criminal prosecution is now defined as terrorism, the civil rights of a citizen, as discussed above, are subject to curtailment.

On the other hand, if domestic terrorism is defined too narrowly, terrorist operatives could potentially slip through loopholes where their activities could only be investigated under the restraints of a criminal procedures code. Out of concern for civil rights, a terrorist act far deadlier than those of September 11, 2001 could occur if the Patriot Act misses the mark in its definition of domestic terrorism.

Section 802 of the Patriot Act, "Definition of Domestic Terrorism," reads:

"[T]he term `domestic terrorism' means activities that--

(A) involve acts dangerous to human life that are a violation of the criminal laws of the United States or of any State;

(B) appear to be intended-- (i) to intimidate or coerce a civilian population; ... (ii) to influence the policy of a government by intimidation or coercion; or ... (iii) to affect the conduct of a government by mass destruction, assassination, or kidnapping; and

(C) occur primarily within the territorial jurisdiction of the United States."

 

[ELKCHSR]

Do you even understand what the word "Terrorist" means????

Why would you even think such goofy thoughts? At least the majority of us don't hide behind anonimity to try and protect ourselves from the small realities of our lives. Most of us have either served or been very appreciative of what we have done for this country, not sat back in our little glass house throwing stones at imaginary demons thinking we are saving the world, while hiding from the truth of reality. this emodicon is for you...