In todays episode of no s%!t:

Citing habitat loss. That in itself is hilarious. Ever been to Estes Park? lol How much habitat do they have?

OVERGRAZING, predators, and female tag allocation.....that is the root of all of our troubles for deer and elk herd sustainability in any state.
 
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“Habitat loss is among the biggest problems, district wildlife manager Brian Wooldrich noted that that is out of the agencies control.”

How is habitat management out of the CPW’s control? Isn’t that one of their primary their jobs?
They’re referring to what happens on private property. New building in winter habitat is a real problem that CPW has no control over.
 
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They’re referring to what happens on private property. New building in winter habitat is a real problem that CPW has no control over.
Sure they do. If it’s that critical to the future of elk in Colorado they need to Buck up and figure out a way to protect it whether it’s through leasing, easements, purchasing, working with the county and cities to change zoning ordinances or however else they may. I know it’s easier said than done. But just saying It’s out of our control is not an acceptable answer. Just think if Aldo Leopoldo, Audobon, Ding darling, Teddy Roosevelt, hunters and all their conservationist wildlife officials said “It’s out of our control” in 1900. Many people a lot more in the know then me feel we are at the crux of modern wildlife NOW! Bird species, amphibians, reptiles are all going to the wayside but no one notices because the deer and elk are stable. Colorado is saying it’s out of their control. I call Bullshit.
 
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Sure they do. If it’s that critical to the future of elk in Colorado they need to Buck up and figure out a way to protect it whether it’s through leasing, easements, purchasing, working with the county and cities to change zoning ordinances or however else they may. I know it’s easier said than done. But just saying It’s out of our control is not an acceptable answer. Just think if Aldo Leopoldo, Audobon, Ding darling, Teddy Roosevelt, hunters and all their conservationist wildlife officials said “It’s out of our control” in 1900. Many people a lot more in the know then me feel we are at the crux of modern wildlife NOW! Bird species, amphibians, reptiles are all going to the wayside but no one notices because the deer and elk are stable. Colorado is saying it’s out of their control. I call Bullshit.
They can do something, but they can't control it all. Look at the debacle over the Vail Bighorn issue. CPW can work to get an easement but they can't necessarily buy land so it doesn't get developed. They aren't going to be able to stop every development in elk and deer habitat. State game agencies are more in the business of making recommendations than actual decision-making.

I'm kind of surprised they're still talking about the impacts as if we haven't known about this for the past decade. It has been well documented that this area's elk have been declining and recruitment is brutal. It is past time to start acting on the science. I guess that means bringing wolves back...
 
Citing habitat loss. That in itself if hilarious. Ever been to Estes Park? lol How much habitat do they have?

OVERGRAZING, predators, and female tag allocation.....that is the root of all of our troubles for deer and elk herd sustainability in any state.
That for sure has a lot to do with it. I can however say it is not the same for deer in every state. My home state our deer populations are still high, but not as high as they used to be, and not as many quality deer, but thats mainly due to habitat loss. Especially in my certain county.
 
They can do something, but they can't control it all. Look at the debacle over the Vail Bighorn issue. CPW can work to get an easement but they can't necessarily buy land so it doesn't get developed. They aren't going to be able to stop every development in elk and deer habitat. State game agencies are more in the business of making recommendations than actual decision-making.

I'm kind of surprised they're still talking about the impacts as if we haven't known about this for the past decade. It has been well documented that this area's elk have been declining and recruitment is brutal. It is past time to start acting on the science. I guess that means bringing wolves back...
How did the vail bighorn debacle end up in the end? O yea, that’s right people, worked their tails off and protected sheep winter range. It didn’t come easy but no one said we can’t protect it all so let’s not protect any of it.
 
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Sure they do. If it’s that critical to the future of elk in Colorado they need to Buck up and figure out a way to protect it whether it’s through leasing, easements, purchasing, working with the county and cities to change zoning ordinances or however else they may. I know it’s easier said than done. But just saying It’s out of our control is not an acceptable answer. Just think if Aldo Leopoldo, Audobon, Ding darling, Teddy Roosevelt, hunters and all their conservationist wildlife officials said “It’s out of our control” in 1900. Many people a lot more in the know then me feel we are at the crux of modern wildlife NOW! Bird species, amphibians, reptiles are all going to the wayside but no one notices because the deer and elk are stable. Colorado is saying it’s out of their control. I call Bullshit.
I was a RMEF Committee member in Western Colorado for a number of years and many of our efforts focused on preserving winter range. Unfortunately many land developers will earn much more money by breaking up land than either private groups like RMEF, Mesa Land Conservancy etc can afford To mitigate. Efforts to conserve winter range are increasing but not as fast as development.
 
In 2018 cpw proposed to limit archery elk in e16 which is basically eagle an Pitkin counties including vail. At the time they were claiming the elk herd had declined from an over objective ~10,000 elk to 4600. While the elk herd was in decline they were selling rifle cow tags valid on public lands in the archery season, plo either sex tags, and either sex rifle tags. At the time they stated the decline was due to backcountry intrusion causing calf mortality, basically over recreation, and trails. Rifle bull tags were to remain unlimited, but archery closures was proposed to fix it?

At the time I was the cba rep and worked with then nw regional manager jt romatske and the senior biologist. Jt told me they were "making a statement about trails" I suspect the closure was all about the proposed trails in steamboat.

Article after article then hot newspapers about how trails and rec is killing the wildlife.

Now 5 years later from 2018, CPW stats from may quota setting show the elk herd has about double from the 2018 population of 4600, during an absolute explosion of outdoor rec during covid. It would be nice to see an explanation.

Now apparently development is the downfall.

I don't doubt development, trails and more can create problems, but the continual stories coming from e16 are a bit hard to swallow.
 
I don’t know how CPW can accurately manage any sort of herd numbers and then follow up with proper tag allocations. They don’t even have mandatory harvest reporting. Their ridiculous manner of random polling to check harvest is a joke. If the rest of their research efforts follow similar methods I’m not sure how well I’d believe CPW at all.
 
In 2018 cpw proposed to limit archery elk in e16 which is basically eagle an Pitkin counties including vail. At the time they were claiming the elk herd had declined from an over objective ~10,000 elk to 4600. While the elk herd was in decline they were selling rifle cow tags valid on public lands in the archery season, plo either sex tags, and either sex rifle tags. At the time they stated the decline was due to backcountry intrusion causing calf mortality, basically over recreation, and trails. Rifle bull tags were to remain unlimited, but archery closures was proposed to fix it?

At the time I was the cba rep and worked with then nw regional manager jt romatske and the senior biologist. Jt told me they were "making a statement about trails" I suspect the closure was all about the proposed trails in steamboat.

Article after article then hot newspapers about how trails and rec is killing the wildlife.

Now 5 years later from 2018, CPW stats from may quota setting show the elk herd has about double from the 2018 population of 4600, during an absolute explosion of outdoor rec during covid. It would be nice to see an explanation.

Now apparently development is the downfall.

I don't doubt development, trails and more can create problems, but the continual stories coming from e16 are a bit hard to swallow.
Whats the code for one of those September rifle cow tags? I want one of those!
 
Whats the code for one of those September rifle cow tags? I want one of those!
They removed the unit 45 September rifle cow tags when the cba brought it to their attention in 2018, in fact they removed almost all cow tags hunt codes until last year when they reinstated rifle cow tags. I'd have to look at the book, I don't think archers got any.
 
They are obviously setting the stage to be able to say wolves solved everything after they eat all the calves.

So transparent
 
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