How do I get a law changed. Dewalt Game Cart

[amescattle]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=baiGtVEw-4I

I have called the Montana fish wildlife and parks department and they tell me I cant use this.

I would like to get this game cart approved for use in the MT BLM, Lewis and Clark national forest, National forest, State of MT ground, CM Russell, and any other non designated or proposed wilderness.



Please refer to 36 CFR 261.2



Motorized equipment means any machine activated by a nonliving power source except small battery-powered hand carried devices such as flashlights, shavers, Geiger counters, and cameras.



Motor vehicle means any vehicle which is self-propelled, other than:

(1) A vehicle operated on rails; and

(2) Any wheelchair or mobility device, including one that is battery-powered, that is designed solely for use by a mobility-impaired person for locomotion and that is suitable for use in an indoor pedestrian area.



My Game Cart



First -A Dewalt drill should be considered a exception, due to the fact that it is a small battery-powered hand carried device.



Second- This cart is not self propelled. It is only operating when the drill is in use. (unlike a ATV) it is not powered 100% of the time. It is a push cart with drill assistance.



Third- When considering a law or a rule, to make a decision on that rule we look at the intent behind the law. (The intent is listed as. To limit erosion and to protect plants and wildlife). With that being said, My cart does not create any pollution and does limit erosion. Since my cart is a push cart and requires you to push it while using it (you can't ride or drive it) You don't create any further erosion using the drill, than you would by simply pushing it.



Fourth - I am allowed to use a chain saw winch to pull out big game. So let's say I use the chain saw winch to pull my cart with big game on it. Is then legal as well? So can mount a chain saw winch in front of my cart that uses a rope to pull the cart continuously?



Please consider my thoughts

 

[lumbergreg]

I'm sorry my friend.....I agree with Montana. I don't want motors in our back country. We have so little left!! Lets do our very best to keep it wild and natural. Besides, kill a big bull, call some buddies to help you haul it out on your own back with your own sweat and blood. You will remember that pack out the rest of your days with a smile on your face No matter how much it hurt on the front side.

 

[Jwill]

I guess we can agree to disagree, seems to me like that probably violates the intent of the law. Your vehicle has a motor, even if that's just a cordless drill motor.

 

[whiskeydog]

geez...how many batteries would you have to pack to get that cart up and over 5 miles of mountain? sorry...but I vote no on changing the law. i've never really understood game carts anyway...most of the places I hunt would end up being harder to get an animal out in a cart than on your back.

 

[spook12]

I believe your cart is legal,anywhere off-road motorized travel is allowed. The fact is it is a motorized cart,just like an electric wheelbarrow.

 

[amescattle]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=vpTtLYESdF0
Just made a new video.

A battery last for 15 min... I have a mount for 5 plus the drill. So it will go about 2 miles

 

[amescattle]

I have also made one that uses only compressed air. No motor

 

[elk_hunter]

Use those contraptions where motorized vehicles are allowed...everywhere else, nope!

 

[Frenchy]

Thats a pretty sweet contraption. Kind of curious to see how much drive power it actually produces going up hills over obstacles and what not. What does the thing weigh empty? Looks pretty heavy just by itself.

I can't think of a time where hauling it around would be easier than just packing something out for me personally, but still its a pretty neat idea.

On the law side of things.....Its a motorized cart not matter how you look at it. Good luck getting a law changed to allow it where such things are not allowed.

 

[Carrion Carrier]

No motorized carts please!

 

[MT_elk]

The engineering and concept is a great idea. However, in reality, most all of the terrain I hunt would not facilitate this type of game cart. Looks to me like you'd need a fairly flat surface. Side hilling would definitely be out. As far as the law goes, the real question is: where do you draw the line? You have to draw a line somewhere. This would open up electric motorcycles, etc. I have to agree that the current law is fair.

 

[muleguy]

You may have a bigger problem than the motor-If you are talking wilderness-no wheels allowed no matter how they are powered.

 

[amescattle]

I hunt the CM Russell and I also use it in Lincoln MT, and East Glacier...
I have used the cart for years. It works great. I normally hunt about 1-5 miles "in".

I don't want to allow ATVs or Motorcycles (electric powered or not)..

You can not ride my device you have to walk and push it. The drill just works as assistance on hill sides

I have tested it on a 50 degree hill side with 600 lbs Seems to work well.

Of course you cant use it in any designated wilderness areas.

If I took it where motor vehicles are allowed than I would have just bought a ATV.

It weighs about 60 lbs right now and I am working on a aluminum model.

Thanks for all the input.... Keep the thoughts coming.... I am working on getting cabala's to sell this at their locations world wide.

 

[amescattle]

Definitions from Title 36 Code of Federal Regulations: http://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/36/261.2

Vehicle means any device in, upon, or by which any person or property is or may be transported including any frame, chassis, or body of any motor vehicle, except devices used exclusively upon stationary rails or tracks.

I also found this definition. If I wanted to get to the brass tacks of this definition. I think we should not be able to use saddles or Pack rack saddles on horses. (Every outfitter in the state)

Because a saddle or a pack saddle is a device in, upon, or by which any person or property is or may be transported .... by this definition we can use horses but cant use the saddle.

Thoughts

 

[Frenchy]

Only the saddle isn't doing the transporting. The saddle does nothing without the horse.

I think the cart is great, just think it belongs firmly in the mororized classification.

 

[spook12]

Definitions from Title 36 Code of Federal Regulations: http://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/36/261.2

Vehicle means any device in, upon, or by which any person or property is or may be transported including any frame, chassis, or body of any motor vehicle, except devices used exclusively upon stationary rails or tracks.

I also found this definition. If I wanted to get to the brass tacks of this definition. I think we should not be able to use saddles or Pack rack saddles on horses. (Every outfitter in the state)

Because a saddle or a pack saddle is a device in, upon, or by which any person or property is or may be transported .... by this definition we can use horses but cant use the saddle.

Thoughts

You must have missed the part about ''Motor vehicle''.
Saddle on a Horse, OK. Saddle on a motorized vehicle,Nope.

 

[CabinFever]

Definitions from Title 36 Code of Federal Regulations: http://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/36/261.2

Vehicle means any device in, upon, or by which any person or property is or may be transported including any frame, chassis, or body of any motor vehicle, except devices used exclusively upon stationary rails or tracks.

I also found this definition. If I wanted to get to the brass tacks of this definition. I think we should not be able to use saddles or Pack rack saddles on horses. (Every outfitter in the state)

Because a saddle or a pack saddle is a device in, upon, or by which any person or property is or may be transported .... by this definition we can use horses but cant use the saddle.

Thoughts

I suppose if a saddle was mounted on any "motor vehicle" it would be illegal. Don't see how horses fall into the category "of any motor vehicle".

Cool product, but when you make an exception here, then there are more to follow. Keep non-motorized areas NON-motorized.

 

[sbhooper]

I do not agree with a motorized cart anywhere, but that is my opinion. If you want to try to change a law, you have to approach your game commissioners with the idea and why it is necessary.

I have a friend in Az that collects high-dollar double shotguns. He got the law changed in Az so that he could hunt with his eight-gauge double. He showed them that the gun actually had a less potent load than the modern 10-gauge and could not stand modern loads. He got the law changed for next year and will be able to hunt turkeys or whatever with it. He appeared before them several times, but finally made his case.

Like I said, I do not agree with it, but if you feel that it has merit, it is up to no one but you to appeal your case.