Question About Hiring

[Shangobango]

Why do those things negatively impact their ability to perform the job? What job are you talking about? mtmuley

Pretty much any one that involves dealing with clients but even more so potential clients.

This is really common sense to be honest. Take a look around at people who work for the vast majority businesses out there that have progressed much beyond entry level positions. You won’t see a whole lot of face tattoos and 2” gauges in ears.

Plenty of sleeves, nose piercings, lip piercings etc. but I can’t think of one person that works for my company or any of our dozens and dozens of clients, which are primarily medium or large companies, that has progressed beyond lower management and also has face tats and over the top piercing or facial type body modifications.

 

[Shangobango]

It doesn’t. Here is the internal problem I had have. I assume the person picks a tattoo that they think represents a part of them and their personality. So should I judge the skull and crossbones or barbed wire or rattlesnake? If an argue that the person “just thought it was cool” then do they make impetuous decisions on whatever is going through their head that day?

I get your point, and agree. But I have hired enough to know it is a roll of the dice. After a long day of interviewing, stuff started creeping in my head about why one candidate is better than another, and my career was suit and tie BS. I’m sure not of it mattered and maybe jobs are different?

The conundrum- people get tattoos to show something about themselves but don’t want to be judged by their tattoos.

Precisely.

 

[BuzzH]

It doesn’t. Here is the internal problem I had have. I assume the person picks a tattoo that they think represents a part of them and their personality. So should I judge the skull and crossbones or barbed wire or rattlesnake? If an argue that the person “just thought it was cool” then do they make impetuous decisions on whatever is going through their head that day?

I get your point, and agree. But I have hired enough to know it is a roll of the dice. After a long day of interviewing, stuff started creeping in my head about why one candidate is better than another, and my career was suit and tie BS. I’m sure not of it mattered and maybe jobs are different?

The conundrum- people get tattoos to show something about themselves but don’t want to be judged by their tattoos.

Every new hire is the roll of the dice and I see past the tattoos.

 

[Scott85]

Everytime I see a nose ring I remember as a child my grandfather putting a 2k pound Holstein bull on his knees twisting a nose ring. Bull was blowing hell fire but listening to my grandfather.

I don’t think the people wearing nose rings understand the security risk for a little bit of ugly fashion.

Every mean bull I’ve ever seen were Holsteins. Working on a dairy farm every bull had not only a ring but a chain attached to it so they couldn’t run that fast. The chains didn’t really slow them down they learned to hold their heads high. Had one bust through a electric fence and knock some guys off 4 wheelers.

 

[fishing4sanity]

@Steiny77 if you've got two candidates that are both qualified, you have to choose based on something. You know your business and clientele, if you worry about if one fits or not, you have your answer. I have no tattoos, but see a lot that I like. One of my daughter-in-laws has numerous tattoos and I'm fine with them. However, rather this is sexist or not, I feel the tattoo canvas fills up much quicker on a woman than on a man. Lastly, you guys make me feel old, I had no idea who Post Malone was.

 

[Nick87]

Every mean bull I’ve ever seen were Holsteins. Working on a dairy farm every bull had not only a ring but a chain attached to it so they couldn’t run that fast. The chains didn’t really slow them down they learned to hold their heads high. Had one bust through a electric fence and knock some guys off 4 wheelers.

Never met any of em that I trusted. That'll get you killed. Jerseys however were always the most aggressive ime.

 

[brymoore]

Never met any of em that I trusted. That'll get you killed. Jerseys however were always the most aggressive ime.

We should start a dairy bull thread.

I grew up in a dairy country that included Amish. Hundreds of dairy farms. Every year someone was injured or killed by Holstein or Jersey bulls.

My few memories are spending four hours in a pasture as the bull snorted and kicked dirt around the tree I climbed as he chased me. My father picked me up on a tractor with me dropping into it from high limbs. He told me I should have just run past him. Yeah.

Sister and I were caught in the pasture walking to the farm house. We saw the bull kicking dirt with his front leg like a Mexican bull fight. We both yelled BULL and ran to roll under the barbwire fence as he chased us.

Good times.

 

[Nick87]

We should start a dairy bull thread.

I grew up in a dairy country that included Amish. Hundreds of dairy farms. Every year someone was injured or killed by Holstein or Jersey bulls.

My few memories are spending four hours in a pasture as the bull snorted and kicked dirt around the tree I climbed as he chased me. My father picked me up on a tractor with me dropping into it from high limbs. He told me I should have just run past him. Yeah.

Sister and I were caught in the pasture walking to the farm house. We saw the bull kicking dirt with his front leg like a Mexican bull fight. We both yelled BULL and ran to roll under the barbwire fence as he chased us.

Good times.

My old man always said it's the gentle bull that's the most dangerous because you never know when he's gonna change his mind.

 

[Mallardsx2]

^^ Grew up on a dairy farm. Never turn your back on a bull. They WILL kill you.

I don't turn my back on someone with face tattoos either. Because, well, you also, just never know....lol

 

[jimh406]

It wouldn’t be disrimination, but I’d look into this deeper. Will customers see your customer service rep, are your customers more like customer 1 or 2? Do the tats show a troubled person or creative one … is creativity valued by your company, etc.

 

[Forkyfinder]

I was a supervisor at my last gig, had 7 on my team over a while.

The best employee at the company happened to be one of mine - he was one of the 3 i started with. He had piercings, tattoos, and an "image" that looked untraditional. He was into anime, video games, and a lot of other things that im simply not.

He was the hardest working kid id ever been around. With some time, i found any concerns i had around him being around the client were unwarranted (and my concerns said more about me than him)- results speak loudest amongst a team, clients, or on a project with others. I found out quickly -if you protect people, let them be vulberable enough to ask any question (i.e. the only stupid question is one not being asked), and take interest in their career/growth/success, mentor and educate them good people will quickly rise.

Hire the person who you can see doing the job well and with a passion, not the person you feel you can relate to best.

Discrimination due to your perception is a very large cost.

 

[Dsnow9]

I was a supervisor at my last gig, had 7 on my team over a while.

The best employee at the company happened to be one of mine - he was one of the 3 i started with. He had piercings, tattoos, and an "image" that looked untraditional. He was into anime, video games, and a lot of other things that im simply not.

He was the hardest working kid id ever been around. With some time, i found any concerns i had around him being around the client were unwarranted - results speak loudest amongst a team, clients, or on a project with others. I found out quickly -if you protect people, let them be vulberable enough to ask any question (i.e. the only stupid question is one not being asked), and take interest in their career/growth/success, mentor and educate them good people will quickly rise.

Hire the person who you can see doing the job well and with a passion, not the person you feel you can relate to best.

^^^This

I have hired a lot of people over the years in an industry that attracts a lot of people from rough lives. I was often hiring entry level positions but when hiring higher level positions I hired off of personality and fit more than resume. I consistently had the highest producing team despite the fact that on paper we were not the most qualified. A team that gets along, has positive attitudes and similar work ethics is a dream if you’re willing to do the training. My recommendation to the op is to hire the person that will be the best fit on your team. Tattoos, piercings, and what they do on their free time should have no bearing on the decision this day and age if they can show up and do the job.

 

[Gus Chiggins]

It doesn’t. Here is the internal problem I had have. I assume the person picks a tattoo that they think represents a part of them and their personality. So should I judge the skull and crossbones or barbed wire or rattlesnake? If an argue that the person “just thought it was cool” then do they make impetuous decisions on whatever is going through their head that day?

I get your point, and agree. But I have hired enough to know it is a roll of the dice. After a long day of interviewing, stuff started creeping in my head about why one candidate is better than another, and my career was suit and tie BS. I’m sure not of it mattered and maybe jobs are different?

The conundrum- people get tattoos to show something about themselves but don’t want to be judged by their tattoos.

I have no issue with tattoos, and here in Portland they’re certainly very popular, esp. sleeves.

There are studies that look at potential connections between tattoos and behavior such as the propensity to undertake risky behavior.

I’m not saying it’s true or not, but this is what some medical professionals have said (and is probably in a lot of people’s subconscious anyway):

Abstract​

Background: Tattoos have reached broadening mainstream acceptance. Medical professional societies have noted that tattoos may co-occur with high risk behaviors.

Methods: Using a variety of statistical models applied to a sample of 2,008 adults residing in the United States via Amazon's Mechanical Turk, we estimate the associations between tattoo characteristics, three health-related outcomes (overall health status, ever diagnosed with a mental health issue, sleep problems), and three risky behaviors (current smoking, ever spent time in jail or prison, and number of sex partners).

Results: We find that the presence, number, and specific features of tattoos are positively correlated with two of the health-related outcomes (ever diagnosed with a mental health issue and trouble sleeping) and all three of the risky behaviors (P < .05). Magnitudes are larger for those with multiple, visible, and offensive tattoos.

Conclusions: Our results suggest that individuals with tattoos are more likely to engage in risky behaviors relative to their non-tattooed counterparts, which may lead to health consequences. Dermatologists, healthcare providers, and public health advocates should recognize that having a tattoo(s) is a potential marker for mental health issues and risky behaviors.
© 2019 The International Society of Dermatology.

Are tattoos associated with negative health-related outcomes and risky behaviors? - PubMed

Our results suggest that individuals with tattoos are more likely to engage in risky behaviors relative to their non-tattooed counterparts, which may lead to health consequences. Dermatologists, healthcare providers, and public health advocates should recognize that having a tattoo(s) is a...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Are People Who Get Tattoos Really More Reckless and Impulsive?

Tattoos, shortsightedness, and impulsivity.

www.psychologytoday.com

Edit to add excerpt from second article:


“This result supports the notion that shortsightedness predisposes individuals to getting tattooed.

Future Research​

There is more to learn about the relationship between tattoos and time preferences. Our study did not ask about the content of the tattoo. One can imagine that some, for example, more risqué or outright offensive tattoos might predict more impulsivity and shortsightedness than other, more thoughtful tattoos.

Also, it would be interesting to explore whether the rise in tattoos reflects increased shortsightedness among the younger generation or a reduced social sigma and greater acceptance of tattoos.”

 

[Gus Chiggins]

Every mean bull I’ve ever seen were Holsteins. Working on a dairy farm every bull had not only a ring but a chain attached to it so they couldn’t run that fast. The chains didn’t really slow them down they learned to hold their heads high. Had one bust through a electric fence and knock some guys off 4 wheelers.

Any Charolais scared me as a kid. They seemed a little nuts.

 

[SAJ-99]

Every new hire is the roll of the dice and I see past the tattoos.

For sure. I don’t think it is a question of tattoos or no tattoos. Extreme example, what if the candidate had a swastika on their arm or neck, or SATAN. You going see past those and roll the dice with that person? I’m not sure I could.

 

[BigHornRam]

Never met any of em that I trusted. That'll get you killed. Jerseys however were always the most aggressive ime.

My best man's dad was killed by a Holstein bull that snuck in behind his back while he was feeding the hogs. Sad deal. Most dairy farmers I worked for, used AI, and didn't have bulls on the farm, thankfully.

 

[WesternRookie]

Haven't read all the replies. HR guy here.

Depends on the nature of the business, and whether or not the role is customer facing. Plenty of people in client-facing white collar roles have full sleeves or other tats/piercings under their clothes, but when they are on the job you wouldn't know it unless they are wearing a short sleeved shirt. If someone has a giant @#)(# or swaztikas tatooed on their forehead, that's their right, but it's going to close some doors.

Ultimately as an employer, you have to use your head and be smart about it. If you end up hiring the other person without the tats, you don't tell the person with the tats "we couldnt hire you because of your appearance." You simply say, "we felt the other person was a better fit. Thanks for your time."

It's not a matter of judging people. Military, first responders, manufacturing, trades...... Head to toe tatts is all good. But there are certain kinds of jobs/settings in services industries like banking, sales, and many corporate environments where where it could be a distraction and therefore not preferred when there is an option to not have it (by hiring someone else).

All that said, customer service roles are generally the lowest paid office job there is, so you are already scraping the bottom of the barrel when it comes to the candidate pool, and should lower your standards accordingly.

 

[howl]

Depends on where you are I guess. I've filed applications just because I didn't like their name. Would modified people rather work among modified or straight-laced?

 

[westbranch]

We had an applicant with an "@aol.com" email address which was a big red flag. They turned out to be a great employee so I try not to jump to conclusions.

 

[Shangobango]

Any Charolais scared me as a kid. They seemed a little nuts.

I used to show Charolais bulls back in my 4H days. They were pretty gentle.

Brahman bulls, omg…meanest bastards on the planet.