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  1. Default Is too late to start from 0 for goats, sheep and moose in any western state?

    Is it too late to start from 0 for points in any western state? I'm 33 and in great health so I would like to think I have at least to the age of 65-70 of playing around in the mountains before I need to hang up. If it isn't too late what would be a good state to start in. I'm not discounting the unlimits in MT. Thanks for the help!!

  2. Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Scott85 View Post
    Is it too late to start from 0 for points in any western state? I'm 33 and in great health so I would like to think I have at least to the age of 65-70 of playing around in the mountains before I need to hang up. If it isn't too late what would be a good state to start in. I'm not discounting the unlimits in MT. Thanks for the help!!
    Thatís a tough call. If you have a bunch of extra money it might be worth it. Wyoming is about $500 a year to apply for moose, sheep, and goat. No points for goat. Colorado is a little over $400 to apply for all 3. Montana is around $250.

    The thing is there are guys that are the same age as you but started in their teens. So donít expect to ever have the most points. Also states are going to keep upping the price. Example Wyoming and Colorado this year.

    Idaho there arenít any points. So itís a level playing field every year. Same in New Mexico.

    Honestly looking at the numbers of over $1k a year to apply for just 3 states moose, sheep, and goat I think a guy just starting out is money ahead to save as much as possible, invest it, and buy the tags he wants.

    Idaho is probably worth applying. Itís about $200 a year and you can only apply for 1 species. But the odds of drawing are pretty good compared to other states.

  3. #3

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    i am not familiar with the odds in all states, but in general I don’t think you would be guaranteed to draw within even 30 years. You can draw without max points in some states (Utah, Colorado, others) but it is extremely unlikely but it does happen. Idaho and New Mexico don’t have point systems so you have an equal chance as other non residents.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
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    North Dakota
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    You would be better off taking a drive and throwing your money out the window dollar by dollar and letting the wind take it. At least you would get a nice car ride out of it and perhaps grab a bite to eat before it's all gone.

  5. #5

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    Quote Originally Posted by BlakeA View Post
    You would be better off taking a drive and throwing your money out the window dollar by dollar and letting the wind take it. At least you would get a nice car ride out of it and perhaps grab a bite to eat before it's all gone.
    You have to love the humor in this response .LOL

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    Quote Originally Posted by fulldraw View Post
    You have to love the humor in this response .LOL
    It was very poetic!

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
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    St. Charles, Illinois
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    558

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    Quote Originally Posted by BlakeA View Post
    You would be better off taking a drive and throwing your money out the window dollar by dollar and letting the wind take it. At least you would get a nice car ride out of it and perhaps grab a bite to eat before it's all gone.
    Sadly, that's about what it's coming to. I am 59 and started 23 years ago. Just got a couple moose hunts out of it. As the nonrefundable fees jacked over the years, I abandoned points and walked away from all but one, CO sheep. And now my slim chance there is becoming none thanks to their rule change. All I can say is I'm glad I limited my losses. Could have been a lot worse. As dt pointed out, if you have a ton of coin, you still might consider it. But otherwise no way I'd buy in at the ground floor with the current systems. Unfortunately, all states only care about bringing wealthy hunters to their states. They really have no interest in average Joe Hunter. If I were you at your age, I'd just save and settle for a Canadian moose or caribou hunt. Maybe get some walleye fishing out of the trip as well.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zim View Post
    Sadly, that's about what it's coming to. I am 59 and started 23 years ago. Just got a couple moose hunts out of it. As the nonrefundable fees jacked over the years, I abandoned points and walked away from all but one, CO sheep. And now my slim chance there is becoming none thanks to their rule change. All I can say is I'm glad I limited my losses. Could have been a lot worse. As dt pointed out, if you have a ton of coin, you still might consider it. But otherwise no way I'd buy in at the ground floor with the current systems. Unfortunately, all states only care about bringing wealthy hunters to their states. They really have no interest in average Joe Hunter. If I were you at your age, I'd just save and settle for a Canadian moose or caribou hunt. Maybe get some walleye fishing out of the trip as well.
    What would you consider "a ton of coin"? by no way am I rich but I do have some disposable income that can be devoted solely for hunting.

  9. #9

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    You are about 21 years too late. You’ll forever be behind the guys your age (and younger) whose parents started getting them points at 12 years old.

  10. #10

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    If you truly love sheep and want to hunt them you will find a way to be around them even if you don't have a tag.

    I have found that there are 2 types of sheep guys.
    The ones who love sheep and spend time in sheep country on a regular basis without tags.
    And then there are the guys who rarely if ever sleep anywhere close to sheep country and simply want a picture of themselves next to a dead sheep to show people.

  11. #11

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    It goes without saying sheep tags are tough. My approach has been to apply, not worry about it, and maybe lighting will strike. This year it did for me. I drew CO with 3+0. You can't draw if you don't apply.

  12. #12

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    I'm in the same boat with you, but I'm 35. I have choose not to build points for any of the big 3 and just stick to states with a random draw. I will be doing the Unlimited as much as I can though
    And into the forest I go, to lose my mind and find my soul" - John Muir

  13. #13

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    Just with Wyoming’s fees alone, in a few years you could do a DIY moose hunt in Ontario. You need to go through an outfitter but you could still hunt on your own. Just a thought.

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
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    Portland, OR
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    I had to make that decision recently for my 14 and 12 year old. After doing my research I decided that for them I would just bank money every year and just put in for the states that don’t have points. I realize people get lucky and you can’t draw if you don’t put in but I have a lot of points in states that I will likely never draw and I don’t want my kids to be stuck in the same situation 20 years from now.

    My other concern is the number of tags in 20-30 years. When I drew moose in Utah 9 years ago there were 27 tags for the unit. Last year there were 8. I also drew moose in Wyoming years ago and same thing. Dramatically less tags today.

    My goal for my kids is to hunt deer and elk every year, antelope as often as possible, and if they end up wanting moose, sheep, or goat, we’ll have saved up money to hopefully buy a tag somewhere or get lucky in a state that doesn't have points.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Feb 2018
    Location
    upper michigan
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    thinking a hunt in new zealand/asia/canada while maybe more money up front maybe more feasible at a younger age.

  16. #16

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    Apply for mountain goat hunts in Alaska. No point system and not too expensive for the draw each year. Won’t bankrupt you. You will draw in the near future while you still have your youth. I drew in only seven years. Don’t listen to the naysayers or spend time with negative people. Hit the damn mountain. Good luck!
    Not a hard man to track. Leaves dead men wherever he goes...Captain Terrill
    Don't piss down my back and tell me it's raining...Fletcher

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheGrayRider View Post
    Apply for mountain goat hunts in Alaska. No point system and not too expensive for the draw each year. Won’t bankrupt you. You will draw in the near future while you still have your youth. I drew in only seven years. Don’t listen to the naysayers or spend time with negative people. Hit the damn mountain. Good luck!
    How much did the guide cost for the goat hunt?

  18. #18

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    LOL I have quite the points now and still feel it's a bottomless pit. Not kidding either. My advise don't get in the point game save your bucks and go to alaska for goat Newfoundland for moose and sheep well that's a pricey one either way. But I'd go chase dall in Alaska if I had it to do over years ago when it was somewhat affordable. But you can spend a lot of money in the lower 48 chasing that dream of .001% odds.

    Edit don't over look state raffles super tags draws and such. Terrible odds but cheap to throw your name in the hat.
    Last edited by brownbear932008; 01-12-2019 at 01:06 PM.

  19. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by fulldraw View Post
    You have to love the humor in this response .LOL
    Yeah but you gotta admit there is a lot of truth to that statement also.

  20. #20
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
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    Bismarck, ND
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlakeA View Post
    You would be better off taking a drive and throwing your money out the window dollar by dollar and letting the wind take it. At least you would get a nice car ride out of it and perhaps grab a bite to eat before it's all gone.
    Blasphemy. That's not what you told me earlier this week! Are you trying to bankrupt me or what!?!?

    I absolutely would not start applying if I were you. I'm 34 with 7-9 points in a few states and am not sure it's worth it for me to continue. I felt it was worth it a few years ago when it wasn't nearly as expensive in CO and WY. 3 years ago, it probably cost me roughly $210 or so to apply for and get points for the big 3 in those 2 states (minus mountain goat in WY). This year, I think it'll cost me roughly $750 if I apply for everything. That's getting pretty ridiculous.

    I'd say decide what you would REALLY like to hunt and then just save for that. Moose/mountain goat hunts aren't too outrageous in Canada or Alaska. No they're not cheap, but doable if you saved $500-1,000 a year. Sheep is just tough. Either need to be super lucky to draw a lottery tag or else pay up big money to do it. A MT ewe hunt would be something to think about. I know a few years ago, you could draw one of those tags in 3-5 years or so. I'd honestly like to do that some year.

    Also, the Idaho odds are not nearly as good as they look on paper. The 10% allocation to NR puts them down in the 1-5% range.

  21. #21

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    I'd apply in AZ and NV for sheep. I personally know one hunter who was drawn for Rocky Mtn Bighorn in AZ with 6pts in 2014, shot a 180+ ram too. The same happens in NV too. GJ

  22. #22
    Join Date
    Dec 2002
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    Chugiak, AK
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    I would go as soon as possible, and not expect to be able to go when you are 65-70. That's a lifetime away, and your body/knees, or health could be gone by then. Who knows what can happen. In the last 10-15 years I have certainly seen my abilities decline, mostly my knees and back, and there is nothing I can do about it.

    If you really want to go, save up and don't dick around applying for every tag you can to the tune of $2500 or more a year of non-refundable licenses/points etc. Save $4-500/month (twice what you'd "throw away")... and go in the next 4-5 years on a dall sheep hunt, or save a bit more and go on a bighorn hunt in Canada. Sheep hunts are going up in price about 5-10% or more a year. In 4-5 years you'll be lucky to find a cut rate dall sheep hunt for $20k, that's about the average rate now. There is no guarantee that you will ever draw a tag, much less that there will be any sheep left alive to hunt. As a NR, you could apply for every state offering sheep tags, and only have a chance at 1 of about 200 a year total, regardless of points scheme. Half of those will come from WY and NV.

    As the sheep hunts get further from most peoples' price range, expect the goat hunts to fill the vacuum and prices to follow.
    "No Kuiu here"

  23. #23
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
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    Bend, Orygun
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    I would look at the random odds in the states you're interested in and decide if those odds are worth the non refundable cost.

  24. #24

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    Colorado guys can correct me if I'm wrong.... but for moose I believe you need 3 preference points then anything after that is just chance..... aka no preference pointed needed, so if youre lucky you can draw one in 4 years. At least that's my understanding of it, or at least what it was last year. Bought my first moose preference point in CO for the first time last year, I'm 31
    To what avail are forty freedoms without a blank spot on the map?

  25. #25

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    Yes.

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