Ollin Magnetic Digiscoping System

Pups Progress

Ttannahill14

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Jan 26, 2016
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316
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Central Kansas
Tahoe is almost 8 months old now. Doing great on his retrieving training. Upland I don't think he's quite got it figured out yet but that's okay he's still young. Been super warm the days I've upland hunted him so birds are getting up super early hard for him to even get a chance to point.

Force Fetch training starts Thursday... any helpful tips appreciated! He's been great so far on all the training but I have a weird felling he'll be a stubborn little booger with force fetch.

Couple pics from last weekend:

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Nice!

Love seeing the progress. Our 6 mo old got her first taste of the field yesterday. She's not nearly as far along as yours.
 
Biggest thing with force fetching is consistency. Keep the sessions short, and don’t be afraid to stop the moment you make some progress. Too often we think “oh great he’s got it, let’s do it again “. Pup locks up and then you both end up frustrated.

I use the ear pinch/collar plate method. Transition to an e collar as soon as you’re getting a good foundation and it’s time to start more advanced stuff.

There’s a fine balance as to how much pressure to put n the dog. I made the mistake early on in putting too much pressure on the dog instead of simply holding the pressure until he complied. If your dog starts shutting down and not wanting to have anything to do with fetching you need to back off on the pressure.
 
Biggest thing with force fetching is consistency. Keep the sessions short, and don’t be afraid to stop the moment you make some progress. Too often we think “oh great he’s got it, let’s do it again “. Pup locks up and then you both end up frustrated.

I use the ear pinch/collar plate method. Transition to an e collar as soon as you’re getting a good foundation and it’s time to start more advanced stuff.

There’s a fine balance as to how much pressure to put n the dog. I made the mistake early on in putting too much pressure on the dog instead of simply holding the pressure until he complied. If your dog starts shutting down and not wanting to have anything to do with fetching you need to back off on the pressure.

Pretty dam good advice right here!

I have done two dogs. The first one was a bear to get through. She just didn't want to open her mouth and I was a newbie that was a little nervous in the first place. I just had to stay the course and continue to go through it. Don't get to high or to low be very business like. Once she got "IT" she flew through training. She was a superb gundog.

The second one has such a desire to fetch it was easier but you never really know if you got it done right.
 
I've been reading that I should put all other training on hold until we get through force fetch... would that include hunting? I'd still like to get him out a bunch between now and end of January.

If I'm not allowed to hunt him, could I wait until February 1st to start force fetch? He would be 10months old at that point...he'll also be getting neutered first of february which may make him a little easier to train.
 
I've been reading that I should put all other training on hold until we get through force fetch... would that include hunting? I'd still like to get him out a bunch between now and end of January.

If I'm not allowed to hunt him, could I wait until February 1st to start force fetch? He would be 10months old at that point...he'll also be getting neutered first of february which may make him a little easier to train.

I would hold off doing FF until you are done hunting him. The purpose of FF is to learn to turn pressure on and off (missed by most but probably the most important aspect of FF to pursue higher training levels).

The straight forward reason is for the dog to pick up and hold anything you tell it to. So think of it this way your dog isn't solid on retrieving yet. You are trying to create a standard but then this standard will erode during hunting. All the work you would put into it would fall away on the weekend.
 
Is Tahoe going to be a hunter only - or is he going to compete in trials, competitions, ego contests (trying to have fun here....)?
Reason I ask, I personally think a lot of things expected of bird dogs are unnecessary if what you truly desire is just a good proficient hunting bud.
If the dog has the genetics - hell even if it isn't a papered product - I believe everything revolves around fun and exposure, exposure, exposure.
If you're gonna do the competition, trials, stuff - nevermind. I have no experience there.
 
Is Tahoe going to be a hunter only - or is he going to compete in trials, competitions, ego contests (trying to have fun here....)?
Reason I ask, I personally think a lot of things expected of bird dogs are unnecessary if what you truly desire is just a good proficient hunting bud.
If the dog has the genetics - hell even if it isn't a papered product - I believe everything revolves around fun and exposure, exposure, exposure.
If you're gonna do the competition, trials, stuff - nevermind. I have no experience there.
I'm starting to think you are very right. Or it could be hopefullness that my lack of ability (and time and resources) to train will still turn out a dog I can hunt over...
 
I should have added the caveat that for exposure cubed, one needs a numbers of birds - very preferably wild ones - and access to them.
Lucky people have access to wild birds on private ground. Close behind that, ever so slightly less lucky people have access to wild birds on public ground.
I'll just stick this in -"public ground" -won't push the envelope any further.......
Many people have neither. Living where I do, I forget that.
Don't know how a lazy ass like me could ever develop (?) a good bird dog under those circumstances.
Ben O. Williams has a couple books about bird dogs. Very little training content in any of them. Mostly just ideas, thoughts and stories about dogs. The only bird dog books I've ever been able to read cover to cover. I mentally glaze over attempting to read "Techniques for the Perfect Finished Gundog"............
 
Hopefully you haven't set yourself up for failure/more difficulty by hunting with a dog that hasn't been trained.

Results may vary but you have now allowed your dog to do X, Y, and Z with no repercussions (because he wouldn't understand them). Now you are going to turn around and say, "hey you can't do that anymore". Just may take longer to get your desired results.
 
There you have it. Opinions, opinions....
An eight month old bird dog - which is it?
From -
"Hopefully you haven't set yourself up for failure/more difficulty by hunting with a dog that hasn't been trained".
To -
Get that dude out there on birds and let him get exposure to 'em!
Ain't asking advice on the internet a blast?:D
Hope you and Tahoe have a great time no matter your course of action.
 
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My random thoughts.

The first year IS about exposure. I don't care if the dog isn't fully trained.

I would wait until hunting season is over for the FF training. He might not like your for a while either.

IMO, getting pups exposure at 5-6 months of age is far more valuable than waiting until they are fully trained. Anyway, you aren't training your dog to point, you're allowing him to figure it out on his own through experience.
 
Training a dog is the most frustrating yet at the same time rewarding thing I think I've ever done.

Someone said it a while back that it depends what you want your dog to do. For my dog hunting and competition (retriever HT/FT) were on deck so I was very much inclined to have her trained to that extent. She had quite a bit of training done to get her the "exposure" she needed. For instance, doing marks, she needed to know how to handle to take the proper lines, as well as have the swim-by done to make sure she takes water when needed.

I know I've made mistakes with this dog and I'm sure they won't be the last. Blessing and a curse for dogs to have short life spans, there'll more than likely be another one.
 
It depends on what YOU are used to and what YOU want.

If all I ever wanted was a upland dog how I train a dog would be very different. If all I wanted was upland I would make sure my OB is dam strong and then I would get the dog on birds birds and more birds.

If I want a dog for both upland and water fowl I would be a lot more hesitant on getting the dog on to many birds. If you have the right dog and you do the water fowl stuff later they pick up on the upland stuff pretty easy.

My first dog I had all the time in the world. I was lucky and she turned out to be one of the best dogs a guy could ask for.

The on I have now not so much. I didn't have the time that I had back then due to kids. She is talented and a sweet heart but under trained and over driven. Ya if I was to any of you on an upland hunt you would rave about her skills. 10 minutes in a duck blind if you have any standards she would drive you nuts. It has gotten to the point that it is hard for me to enjoy the hunt.

Moving forward my next dog will most likely be fully trained when I purchase her. I have my standards that I like but I don't have the time to get them there right now. Personally after having a dog like this I would train them the same whether I wanted to run test or just hunt. There is just something about water fowl hunting over a dog that is fully trained, it really is a thing of beauty!
 
Whaddya' do with them ducks after the dog brings them back to the blind - feed 'em to the dog? That seems hardly fair to do that to your best bud:D
Not trying to start an internet confustication, but how anyone can choose to not get an 8 week old heart stealer and instead buy a dog someone else raised and trained is way out of my realm of understanding.
But that's just me. Hope no one is too offended by my weak penchant for the smell of puppy breath........................
 
Thanks for all the thoughtful replies.

I think I'm going to wait til after season to force fetch. This recent cold blast really is the first good cold front of the year for us and finally brought some moisture and birds.

Tahoe is a very easy to work with dog, wants to please me and takes a couple days to communicate what I want but once he figures out what I want he is obedient.

I may try to do a Junior trial just for fun this off season, by looking at the regs he could probably pass that currently. I'm not looking to breed or get ribbons, just a solid versatile bird dog that is also my best bud.

Merry Christmas!

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Whaddya' do with them ducks after the dog brings them back to the blind - feed 'em to the dog? That seems hardly fair to do that to your best bud:D
Not trying to start an internet confustication, but how anyone can choose to not get an 8 week old heart stealer and instead buy a dog someone else raised and trained is way out of my realm of understanding.
But that's just me. Hope no one is too offended by my weak penchant for the smell of puppy breath........................

Puppies are fun but they are also a pain in the ass. They are also very unpredictable. I just want to stack the deck in my favor the next time.

I know enough people that have gone this route and it works out great. A few years later you wouldn't know the difference. Ya if when I get older and have a lot of time I will go puppy route again.
 
Keep having fun with the pup! He seems to be coming along well. I know I was sorely let down early on with my pup when expectations weren't met. Once I re-evaluated my priorities and the causes of those "failures" we started having a lot more fun.
 

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