Talk about 50 shades of gray MT FWP

Coyotes-R-Us · Dec 7, 2017

Talk about 50 shades of gray MT FWP
Montana Fish wildlife and Parks!
Brinkmans Game preserve.
Try finding Information on that.
I stumbled across this looking at my Mariss river BMA map.

Block management areas are public/private areas set aside for hunting with special regulations unique to the area.
Some just walk in some just sign in and some with permission.
On the BMA Map regulations this states "special weapons".
Normally that will mean BP, archery, pistol, or shotguns.
Cool, this is not on any BLM/Forest service map I have maps from 1977 to 2005
I happen to live in GF where the regional FWP office is.
After an exhausting several hour search of there web sight
I went to it.
I ask about what kind of weapons I can use.
Girl at the desk, " I don't know". I'll check. She hit the computer to look , nothing here she says.
OK.
She goes in back and comes out with a Map with reg's on the back.
Looks like only archery during deer season only, otherwise every thing is illegal.

WHAT?
I explain the BMA map does not say that, the computer does not say that, any and all other official public maps don't even SHOW it.
How can that be? Girl behind the counter says "I Don't Know".
It also says I cant run a motorized form of transportation , OK?
So Now I have over 4 hours time searching and a trip to there office and I'm still confused.
So I ask " Using a boat access area just a mile or two up stream asper the BMA maps and want to fish I cant?
No you can the Preserve does not regulate the river asper the "The stream access law". A motorized boat is ok.
Can I duck hunt in the river? I ask. No discharging any weapon on the preserve is illegal. The stream access law says I can hunt /fish/recreate between the high water marks, and the preserve does not regulate the river.
Right she said. So I can shoot ducks? Nope not on the preserve .
What?
So I leave the ramp legal go a mile and I'm illegal for 20 miles then I legal again ? YUP she said.
Is there a warden around today? I ask . No not today .
How can all this be?
I know there is a reason for all the gray areas in our game laws.
It is so the FWP can wright more tickets, I know that.
I made a huge effort to find out all most nothing.
What is a casual recreater to do?
I wonder if there is a rule about hunting/fishing if your wearing green under pants? HOW would I find out?
50 shades of gray!

AvidIndoorsman · Dec 7, 2017

Seem's fairly straight forward... Yes there are two overlapping administrative areas so that means there are lots of rules

For all lands in the BMA BMA rules apply, for a subsection of the lands with the BMA more stringent rules apply. When in the Brinkman Reserve follow all the Brinkman rules + the BMA rules. When in the BMA but not in Brinkman follow just the BMA rules.

The only gray area in my mind would be if you were passing through the Brinkman either by boat or car and had a firearm. Does this constitute carry or do they mean carry in the field. I would assume the later.

Deleted member 20812 · Dec 7, 2017

The Brinkman has been around for many years.

-- HD 400 Lower Marias River -NOTE: Elk numbers are low and will be diﬃcult to find.
Check Restricted Area Legal Description (p 16-17):Brinkman Game Preserve closed to big game hunting except as noted below
General Deer License.
• Sep 02 - Oct 15 - Either-sex Mule Deer. Archery Only Season.
- Either-sex White-tailed Deer. Valid entire HD including Brinkman Game Preserve. Archery Only Season.
• Oct 21 - Nov 12 - Either-sex Mule Deer.
- Either-sex White-tailed Deer. General Elk License.
• Sep 02 - Oct 15 - Either-sex Elk. Archery Only Season.
• Oct 21 - Nov 26 - Either-sex Elk. Elk B License. Drawing only. Apply by June 1. 004-00: 4800 B Licenses. Not valid on National Forest lands, FWP WMAs, or CMR Refuge. Valid in all Region 4 HDs except HDs 410 and 455.
• Sep 02 - Oct 15 - Antlerless Elk. Archery Only Season. • Oct 21 - Nov 26 - Antlerless Elk.

It's addressed in the regulations. You can't hunt in a Game Preserve, regardless of whether you are in a boat or not. The Stream Access Law does not supercede a Game Preserve any more than it would allow you to use it to hunt within city limits. Fishing is not prohibited in a Game Preserve (See Sun River for example). The off road travel restriction is a private land agreement regulation and has nothing to do with the Brinkman itself. You'll note it specifically addresses "motorized wheeled vehicles" and not boats.

Good luck. That's a neat part of the world.

zachthebowhunter · Dec 7, 2017

It shows it on Onx maps.

rammac · Dec 7, 2017

It looks pretty straight forward to me but then I simply read the rules without trying to interpret them in a way that allows me to do what I want.

Coyotes-R-Us · Dec 7, 2017

Yes I can understand not hunting in a game preserve.
I do not have Onx maps.
The fact that I had to look so hard to even find anything.
A Blm map should be plenty.
I could not find any thing in the duck/goose regulations about the game preserve .
That is where a duck hunter would look I would THINK...
AND "I don't Know " Is not an answer you would expect at the FWP Office, regardless if all the wardens
are out for coffee.
Just my thoughts .:hump:

TBass · Dec 7, 2017

Why would it be on a BLM map? It's not a type of land but rather a legally described area with restrictions on what can be hunted. Are you thinking this is something akin to a Wildlife Management area owned by FWP or some other agency?

I do agree though that the information is confusing about what species are restricted. The FWP Hunt Planner and DEA regulations both say big game hunting is closed except as noted in the regulations. There is no mention of other species being closed. As you said, there is nothing about restricted areas in the waterfowl regulations. Nor the upland bird regulations. I assume the area is signed as closed for those species on-site.

Deleted member 20812 · Dec 7, 2017

Coyotes-R-Us said:
Yes I can understand not hunting in a game preserve.
I do not have Onx maps.
The fact that I had to look so hard to even find anything.
A Blm map should be plenty.
I could not find any thing in the duck/goose regulations about the game preserve .
That is where a duck hunter would look I would THINK...
AND "I don't Know " Is not an answer you would expect at the FWP Office, regardless if all the wardens
are out for coffee.
Just my thoughts .:hump:

A BLM map only shows surface ownership. It won't show a game reserve any more than it will show a weapons restricted area.

I looked in the upland and waterfowl regulations and it was not addressed in there. It certainly should be. I would write a letter to the regional wildlife manager asking why it isn't included.

Signage for the Brinkman has always been pretty sketchy.

TRS_Montana · Dec 15, 2017

Well, at least you're not cynical.
Can't imagine why the gal at the FWP office wasn't chasing down any hot leads....

Talk about 50 shades of gray MT FWP

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