Eric, your analysis is only 2nd hand. Robin was elected 10 years in a row as chair by the board. Yet that 10 years doesn't correlate to Billings. What I have seen is nothing but slimy Moga efforts to control votes and to pit outfitters against the public. The board has become totally disfunctional. Changes will be made. I don't really have time to track down comments you make as to authenticity; your accuracy is your responsibility. I have been to many Boo meetings.
Moga Contols Board of Outfitters
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Eric Albus
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Joe, you've been to many more BOO meetings than I have....and I'm an outfitter.
As to my accuracy, if you doubt it call Jack, or John. Both told me the exact same story of manipulation of members, meetings, ect.. The same exact story I heard from Rob Arnaud, and Pat Tabor.
You don't like to fact that Robin is no longer there to do the bidding of the MWF, MSA, ect..
Hopefully any changes will be made for the better.
As to my accuracy, if you doubt it call Jack, or John. Both told me the exact same story of manipulation of members, meetings, ect.. The same exact story I heard from Rob Arnaud, and Pat Tabor.
You don't like to fact that Robin is no longer there to do the bidding of the MWF, MSA, ect..
Hopefully any changes will be made for the better.
Eric Albus
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So, Joe, how was the meeting yesterday? I have not had the chance to talk with Rob yet to see what his take is. Thought I would give you a chance to throw some spin on things right out the gate.
katqanna
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While I had to duck out shortly before it ended to run to Townsend, I found it very interesting, took audio and notes, some things I want to look into further. Besides the two eyebrow raising guides application processes with the DUI's and other charges (statement by one, that the Judge in his current case stated he had also been an outfitter and as soon as the fine was paid he would get it off this guys record?), I was more interested in the discussion with Chief legal counsel Bovington on the data collection issue of the ARM, with the Board's actions versus Governor Bullock's veto of SB 264. I have some documents to look into on that matter.
After FWP made statements about the need for the data, Cunningham made a very good public comment, which I will transcribe later, involving that data gathering being a benefit for the public.
After Cunningham's being targeted in the confirmation process, BOO or MOGA may find that Cunningham's participation in the "peanut gallery", as he called it, might not be the outcome they had wished for.
After FWP made statements about the need for the data, Cunningham made a very good public comment, which I will transcribe later, involving that data gathering being a benefit for the public.
After Cunningham's being targeted in the confirmation process, BOO or MOGA may find that Cunningham's participation in the "peanut gallery", as he called it, might not be the outcome they had wished for.
Eric Albus
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I will not be surprised and neither will anyone else if Cunningham's "participation in the peanut gallery" is anything but more anti-big game outfitter.
Pray tell, in what way can it be a benefit to the public to have that knowledge. Once again, were it used by FWP to actually MANAGE the wildlife I would be first in line and all for it.
Pray tell, in what way can it be a benefit to the public to have that knowledge. Once again, were it used by FWP to actually MANAGE the wildlife I would be first in line and all for it.
Erik, for someone who is never at a meeting, sounds like the the blind leading the blind. Follow thru on bs hear-say. I have seen things manipulated by Moga many times:Taber extensively and now by Rob. Consider Jean's antics! Makes it easy to become anti-MOGA.
As far as any data, those are public trust critters and the public, thru FWP wants the data. Decide if this is the cross you want to die for because the fight will continue.
Rob, I am not going to continue a dialog with you based on your 2nd hand info.
As far as any data, those are public trust critters and the public, thru FWP wants the data. Decide if this is the cross you want to die for because the fight will continue.
Rob, I am not going to continue a dialog with you based on your 2nd hand info.
Eric Albus
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2nd hand? I talked with John W.,& Jack B, in person, you call that 2nd hand?>? Call them if you would also like a "first hand" version of manipulating meetings and people(you can call me if you'd like their cell numbers). I am sure that Mr. Cunningham has some good points and will gladly concede this, but he is biased and very anti big game(especially private land based) outfitting.....
The info, great if we have to continue to report USELESS information so be it....I just wish it was used to benefit of someone instead of to the detriment of the outfitting community. Guys like you don't care though. Typical of folks who want to keep the swamp filled.
The info, great if we have to continue to report USELESS information so be it....I just wish it was used to benefit of someone instead of to the detriment of the outfitting community. Guys like you don't care though. Typical of folks who want to keep the swamp filled.
Topgun 30-06
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Eric---FYI "second hand" is anything that you get passed to you from someone else like the two guys you mentioned in your last post and haven't witnessed for yourself. Carry on!
Eric Albus
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Thanks TG for pointing that out.... If you would like a first hand account from either of the aforementioned call me, I'd give you their numbers also. Then we could both be privy to the same 2nd hand knowledge. 
Topgun 30-06
Active member
I think you knew before hand what Pierre meant when he mentioned "second hand", so your responses to him and myself really don't become you! What you haven't seen or heard "in person" ain't worth jack and that's what he's trying to tell you and you're being more than a little stubborn if you haven't personally attended the meeting(s) you guys are talking about. I have to say that if MOGA is anything like WYOGA in Wyoming then they both suck because all they are interested in is themselves and make a guise of being a great friend of NRs strictly because of the money involved!!! I don't think you're that way at all from what I've seen and heard about you, but overall the outfitting industry in both states sure isn't looking out for anyone but themselves and things they introduce in the Legislatures of both states pretty well proves my point!
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Straight Arrow
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Eric, when in a hole using a secondhand shovel it's wise to quit digging. To the credit of your opinion, I think it would be more persuasive to produce factual information from the minutes of the meetings to which this discussion has referred. The documented discussions and voted positions taken by both organizations on issues is much more revealing than bantering about the secondhand opinions of a few members. 'Just sayin'.
Eric Albus
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Sorry guys, but it is to much temptation to not torture Joe a little bit...he knows that I am right.
TG, wish I could take the time to attend some of the meetings, stubbornness has nothing to do with it. I just don't have much time off, mostly self-inflicted. Only reason I have time to banter a little right now is that I am recovering from surgery and can't get out and do much for another day or 2. To make your point, MOGA is self-serving, the organization is there to work in the benefit of the outfitting industry. However I do not always agree with everything that MOGA has said or done, and have bucked some of the self serving things they have attempted to accomplish legislatively. The wildlife of Montana need to be managed ahead anyone and their interests. Including FWP's and MOGA's. Manage wildlife biologically and the rest will sort itself out.
TG, wish I could take the time to attend some of the meetings, stubbornness has nothing to do with it. I just don't have much time off, mostly self-inflicted. Only reason I have time to banter a little right now is that I am recovering from surgery and can't get out and do much for another day or 2. To make your point, MOGA is self-serving, the organization is there to work in the benefit of the outfitting industry. However I do not always agree with everything that MOGA has said or done, and have bucked some of the self serving things they have attempted to accomplish legislatively. The wildlife of Montana need to be managed ahead anyone and their interests. Including FWP's and MOGA's. Manage wildlife biologically and the rest will sort itself out.
Topgun 30-06
Active member
I respect you from what I've heard about you from others that know you and from your posts on this site. I think you misunderstood what I meant when I said stubborn and I know you have a lot on your plate. I hope you recover from surgery quickly, but do as the Doc says and don't try to do too much too fast and screw yourself up. I think we're pretty much on the same page overall as far as conservation and I know you as an individual can't control everything that MOGA does or says. Maybe you should not be a part of the organization unless you're required to by mandate!
