Colorado and wolves

Of all of the arguments for not re-introducing wolves to an area, danger to humans is probably the most ridiculous. Dogs... yes. Humans... no. I have no opinion on whether or not they should be reintroduced to Colorado, but they are just not a dangerous animal. Perhaps you need to grow up spending lots of time outdoors in wolf country to realize this.
 
NoWiser said:
Of all of the arguments for not re-introducing wolves to an area, danger to humans is probably the most ridiculous. Dogs... yes. Humans... no. I have no opinion on whether or not they should be reintroduced to Colorado, but they are just not a dangerous animal. Perhaps you need to grow up spending lots of time outdoors in wolf country to realize this.
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I couldn't agree more
 
Wolves, when not controlled, DO pose immediate and definite threat to humans.

I worked very closely with a IDFG trapper and hunter back before we had open season on Wolves here in Idaho. At the time we were faced with wolf encounters on our family ranch on an almost daily basis. Livestock loss was devastating, and there were more than a handful of times that we felt quite threatened as well.

When their numbers aren't controlled, packs expand, and new packs looking for new territory turn to domestic animals as their key source of food. This can be Cattle/Horses, pets, and potentially humans. Russia has dealt with this for a very long time.

They must be managed from the onset.

- Joseph
 
Wolves, when not controlled, DO pose immediate and definite threat to humans.
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I have seen many wolves sense the reintroduction, and lots of them when there was no managment at all. I wouldn't say they pose any immediate or definite threat to humans. Some threat is there, but your more apt to be hurt by bees, a rogue deer, lighting than wolves.
 
I have been frightened by wolves, but it was an irrational fear. After living near wolves I am quick to say they are difficult to see even when you are trying. I would agree, with above, the danger is slight.

But I will guarantee they will kill more household pets than trapping will. Many states are eliminating trapping on the save our pets theory. So save them from trapping but introduce wolves? Wolves will take far more pets than traps. Just saying.
 
Good point about silliness and lack of perspective. I stand corrected and my ignorance is now gone. I will now welcome wolves into my community knowing they are not as big a risk as bees just as I would expect you to allow child molesters to be relocated into your community since they are less of a risk of killing an adult than bees. Let's place the bar where you are comfortable and death by bees is reasonable.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_wolf_attacks_in_North_America
 
LopeHunter said:
Good point about silliness and lack of perspective. I stand corrected and my ignorance is now gone. I will now welcome wolves into my community knowing they are not as big a risk as bees just as I would expect you to allow child molesters to be relocated into your community since they are less of a risk of killing an adult than bees. Let's place the bar where you are comfortable and death by bees is reasonable.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_wolf_attacks_in_North_America
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Two key points in surviving life with wolves:

1.) Always yell "they're coming right for us" when you see a wolf. That way nobody can yell at you for poaching a critter since your life was in imminent danger.

2.) It is the opinion of most state veterinarians that you do not put wolf poop in or around your mouth if you want to avoid getting the woof poop worms.
 
Don't get me wrong. Every Wolf isn't going to take the offensive. And now that we're controlling them here, the balance has been VASTLY improved. I wouldn't go as far as to say that the re-introduction was a good idea, in any sense of the word, however.

The effects on ranchers are much worse than the stated statistics in the ADN article. I'm afraid most Wolf kills on livestock aren't reported quickly. And the subsequent investigations are usually too little too late. We lost maybe 40-45 animals to wolves over the course of about a three year period. And only one of those got 'confirmed' by the higher ups. And this doesn't count the cows that miscarried, or didn't get bred as a result of Wolf pressure.

- Joseph
 
LopeHunter said:
Good point about silliness and lack of perspective. I stand corrected and my ignorance is now gone. I will now welcome wolves into my community knowing they are not as big a risk as bees just as I would expect you to allow child molesters to be relocated into your community since they are less of a risk of killing an adult than bees. Let's place the bar where you are comfortable and death by bees is reasonable.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_wolf_attacks_in_North_America
Click to expand...

So where did I say you should allow wolves into your community? Now you've brought child molesters into the conversation. How does Child Molesters being in the community translate with wolves being an imminent danger to people? My point was "stuckinthecitylife's " reasoning NOT to have wolves in Colorado is flawed. (BTW, we do allow child molesters into all our communities)

Not disputing that wolves have killed people. I'm saying that it's a bit of exaggeration to say your in imminent danger if your around wolves that aren't being managed. On average over 100 people die in the US from Bee Stings.

http://www.govexec.com/management/2015/08/bees-are-deadliest-non-human-animals-america-cdc/119328/
 
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2.) It is the opinion of most state veterinarians that you do not put wolf poop in or around your mouth if you want to avoid getting the woof poop worms.
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LMAO, but actually there's some evidence to suggest that wolves can poop either on the ground, or in a stream, then a rain storm, comes along and washes the eggs from the poop down the creek where you can drink those eggs. So the eggs could be contracted more easily than first thought. Moose in Montana are routinely infected with this disease. My young last years moose. PB240729.jpgPB240730.jpg
 
And this doesn't count the cows that miscarried, or didn't get bred as a result of Wolf pressure.
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Cattle must be far bigger pussies than elk and deer. There's no evidence at all to suggest that elk or deer miscarry or don't get breed from living with wolves. Cattle are far less pressured by them so I'm skeptical.

In the elk predator study done here in the Root, a very high number of cow elk were being bred, became pregnant, and birthed the calf. Quality forage was a larger factor in pregnancies, and birth rates the study concluded.
 
shoots-straight said:
In the elk predator study done here in the Root, a very high number of cow elk were being bred, became pregnant, and birthed the calf. Quality forage was a larger factor in pregnancies, and birth rates the study concluded.
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over 90% birthed.
 
stuckinthecitylife said:
Don't get me wrong. Every Wolf isn't going to take the offensive. And now that we're controlling them here, the balance has been VASTLY improved. I wouldn't go as far as to say that the re-introduction was a good idea, in any sense of the word, however.

The effects on ranchers are much worse than the stated statistics in the ADN article. I'm afraid most Wolf kills on livestock aren't reported quickly. And the subsequent investigations are usually too little too late. We lost maybe 40-45 animals to wolves over the course of about a three year period. And only one of those got 'confirmed' by the higher ups. And this doesn't count the cows that miscarried, or didn't get bred as a result of Wolf pressure.

- Joseph
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Not a single rancher has been ate by a wolf. Spreading false information that the "effects on ranchers are much worse" does not serve to advance the discussion.


As someone who has spent plenty of time in a state with wolves AND ranchers, I can assure you that the ranchers have done very well since the wolf populations have been established, based upon the average selling price of Dodge Cummins 1-tons and GMC DuraMaxs..... The effect on ranchers has been positive.
 
Livestock producers do absolutely have valid concerns about large carnivores. Depending on your local gov't trapper, they may be able to offer some good advice on non-lethal, preventative measures tha can be taken so you don't lose the critter or critters. Getting confrimation is tough, which is why the formula for compensation is usually skewed so high towards to producer. Sorry to hear you guys lost cows. That's never good for the bottom line.

And yes, elk & deer are much hardier than cows. They're wild animals who evolved to deal with predators. Cows have evolved to be stationary meat sticks who poop all over themselves.

Shoots - the EG parasite has less threat to humans than even a wolf kill.
 
The original post was not about wolves being a danger to livestock. They definitely are. The post was about them being a danger to humans, which is ridiculous. Maybe once every 50 years someone in the US will be attacked and killed by wolves. In that time how many will be stomped on by moose or killed in an elk/vehicle accident.

If you think wolf populations are dense out west, come visit north-east and north-central Minnesota. We have, by a large margin, the highest population in the lower 48 contained in a relatively small area. I hear them every day and night that I deer hunt and see them often. They follow me in the dark when I walk to my stand and sniff the pup tent I stay in at night, as evidence by their tracks in the snow. If they wanted to eat me, it wouldn't be too hard. I'm often unarmed and never travel with a loaded gun unless I'm still-hunting. Wolves just don't attack people. The only time I've every seen them act remotely aggressive was when I was grouse hunting and my dog was with me. A few shots over their heads and they decided it wasn't in their best interest to kill my pooch.

Just because many are afraid of them doesn't make them dangerous.
 
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