Episode 23 : Greg Gianforte

Nameless Range

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First, Mr. Gianforte seems like a nice guy. He comes off as someone who genuinely loves the outdoors and loves Montana. I appreciate Randy's ability to interview him cordially and to have a productive discussion with him.

I was glad to hear him support Stream Access.
I was glad to hear him say he does not support the transfer or public lands (sort of) and in a recent statement outside of this podcast said he does not support the transfer, "right now."
I like his attitude of focusing on ideas and common goals as opposed to labels.

That said, he could not be more wrong on so much. He is not alone in this, and I'm sure his opponent, Steve Bullock will say things I disagree with too. My thoughts:

1. Complaining about Federal Management of lands without addressing the funding shortages federal agencies face is disingenuous.

2. In spite of the fact that Region 1 met it's timber harvest goals in 2014, discussing the loss of logging jobs and implying it is the government's fault without even bringing up the expiration of the Softwood Tariff reeks of agenda. Also, all this talk of timber treatment is a bunch of wonderful feel-goodery but no one ever addresses the chief concern - Who will pay for it?

3. Logging/thinning/treating the backcountry will do little to reduce the amount of acres burned every summer. Contemporary Forestry Science and Statistics back this up. Just ask Canada about the country that burned up there in 2015.

4. He says that people in charge of State Agencies are driven by ideology - he has said he will change this by appointing a head of industry as director of the DEQ, a landowner in charge of DNRC, etc. When a fox guards a hen house, does it have an ideology?

5. The primary driver of where Elk winter at our latitude is elevation. There is a strong correlation between elevation and aspect and private vs public ownership. Higher = more likely to be public, and less likely to be wintering grounds. Let's be honest about that fact.

6. He claims FWP doesn't care about landowners. There are about 100 pages of discussion on Hunt Talk that are incredibly convincing that they care too much about land owners. He is under the impression that our EMP objectives are based on science, which is utterly false. According to him, if I think Shoulder Seasons are unethical I am an environmental extremist. He said that. Who knew Hunt Talk was so full of environmental extremists.

7. Lastly, because my lunch break is nearly over and I need to get back to my culture of enforcement and not customer service, I think this entire attitude that public employees revel in inefficiency and enforcement stems from an ignorance about what we do.

Thanks for doing the podcast.
 
I very much agree with you nameless. I was surprised that randy interviewed him in such a cordial manner. Wonder what his blood pressure was doing. My blood pressure moved around a bit. Giantforte thinks the shoulder hunts are a great idea and also believes that Montana has way more elk than forests can support. Good job randy
 
It's more important that Randy engage in a manner that allows the person to express their view without intimidation. This allows us the opportunity to really see how they think and now we can make a more informed opinion or vote in this case.
 
I'm not a Montanan so that may influence my decision some, but I shut it off after about 15 minutes. He may like hunting but it seemed clear to me he knows little about wildlife management.
 
It's more important that Randy engage in a manner that allows the person to express their view without intimidation. This allows us the opportunity to really see how they think and now we can make a more informed opinion or vote in this case.

Very much this.

Nice job Randy, I look forward to the podcast with Bullock.
 
I very much agree with you nameless. I was surprised that randy interviewed him in such a cordial manner. Wonder what his blood pressure was doing. My blood pressure moved around a bit. Giantforte thinks the shoulder hunts are a great idea and also believes that Montana has way more elk than forests can support. Good job randy

Coming from an Arizonan with only one elk hunt under his belt.. what's up with/what are shoulder seasons? Is it just an extended season that allows more harvest?

EDIT: haven't listened to the episode yet...about to start it
 
First, Mr. Gianforte seems like a nice guy. He comes off as someone who genuinely loves the outdoors and loves Montana. I appreciate Randy's ability to interview him cordially and to have a productive discussion with him.

I was glad to hear him support Stream Access.
I was glad to hear him say he does not support the transfer or public lands (sort of) and in a recent statement outside of this podcast said he does not support the transfer, "right now."
I like his attitude of focusing on ideas and common goals as opposed to labels.

That said, he could not be more wrong on so much. He is not alone in this, and I'm sure his opponent, Steve Bullock will say things I disagree with too. My thoughts:

1. Complaining about Federal Management of lands without addressing the funding shortages federal agencies face is disingenuous.

2. In spite of the fact that Region 1 met it's timber harvest goals in 2014, discussing the loss of logging jobs and implying it is the government's fault without even bringing up the expiration of the Softwood Tariff reeks of agenda. Also, all this talk of timber treatment is a bunch of wonderful feel-goodery but no one ever addresses the chief concern - Who will pay for it?

3. Logging/thinning/treating the backcountry will do little to reduce the amount of acres burned every summer. Contemporary Forestry Science and Statistics back this up. Just ask Canada about the country that burned up there in 2015.

4. He says that people in charge of State Agencies are driven by ideology - he has said he will change this by appointing a head of industry as director of the DEQ, a landowner in charge of DNRC, etc. When a fox guards a hen house, does it have an ideology?

5. The primary driver of where Elk winter at our latitude is elevation. There is a strong correlation between elevation and aspect and private vs public ownership. Higher = more likely to be public, and less likely to be wintering grounds. Let's be honest about that fact.

6. He claims FWP doesn't care about landowners. There are about 100 pages of discussion on Hunt Talk that are incredibly convincing that they care too much about land owners. He is under the impression that our EMP objectives are based on science, which is utterly false. According to him, if I think Shoulder Seasons are unethical I am an environmental extremist. He said that. Who knew Hunt Talk was so full of environmental extremists.

7. Lastly, because my lunch break is nearly over and I need to get back to my culture of enforcement and not customer service, I think this entire attitude that public employees revel in inefficiency and enforcement stems from an ignorance about what we do.

Thanks for doing the podcast.

Good Points 1 thru 7

Probably shouldn't even respond since I've made no apologies about being a center-left guy politically, as such, nothing the guy said impressed me, but a lot ticked me off. He couldn't and didn't waste an opportunity to slam Bullock, FWP and all the extremist environmental wackos he claims work for FWP and other State Agencies. Same old tired Republican talking points in my opinion. The guy sure does love shoulder seasons though, too bad those extremist environmental wacko FWP employees and a significant number of sportsmen don't share his view.

He was quick to throw out the (I'm not into labels) remark when it was brought to his attention the Republican party platform includes the sell and transfer of our public lands, how convenient.

I don't give a damn about him being a lifetime member of the NRA either, I'm not and proud to no longer being affiliated with that group.

You didn't convince or impress me Greg but that wasn't likely to happen anyway.
 
Removed my comment until I actually listened to the entire recording. Great work there Randy getting all these folks to speak so freely. Excellent.
 
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Listened to a portion of the podcast again, now I'm really po'd

Bullocks no friend of gun owners because he vetoed a couple bills the lunatic fringe Republican controlled legislature passed? He should be granted a second term just for standing up to these lunatics. I'm a gun owner and probably have been for longer than you Mr.Gianforte, and I consider Bullock a great friend of gun owners like myself, and more importantly of Sportsmen. Thank God Bullock has common sense.
 
Not for transferring public land, for 2nd amendment, and for rewriting an emp. You can't get everything perfect but what's so bad about that? You guys are a tough crowd.
 
Not for transferring public land, for 2nd amendment, and for rewriting an emp. You can't get everything perfect but what's so bad about that? You guys are a tough crowd.

He's for handing management over to county commissions, while thinking the fed will pay for it. Do you really think county commissioners will do a better job managing public land instead of the people who work for the agencies? Same problems will exist, all he is doing is shofting the balance of power to a group of electeds rather than professionals. It also means that he expects congress to give counties money to do this.

He prmotes bills that would let frat boys have glocks on campus, and bills that were patently unconstitutional while saying he applied for a suppressor after Bullock signed the suppressor bill, and actually broadened it to make it apply to all species, rather than just wolves.

FWP Commission has already asked that the emp be addressed next year, and the agency has agreed to it. More importantly, who would he appoint to the commission, and who would be the next FWP Director?

At most, he's parsing the issues, and at worst, he's misrepresenting what Bullock has done.

This interview raises a lot more questions than it answers.
 
He prmotes bills that would let frat boys have glocks on campus,

Are you only concerned about frat boys exercising their constitutional rights on campus, or would you suppress the right for all students? :)
 
Not for transferring public land, for 2nd amendment, and for rewriting an emp. You can't get everything perfect but what's so bad about that? You guys are a tough crowd.

I agree that he could be worse and if he is our governor come Nov then I will have less heartburn than I would with others.

That said, he did at one point refer to the "wisdom of the legislature" when it came to their war on elk via Shoulder Seasons.

He said wisdom and legislature in the same sentence.:rolleyes:
 
Are you only concerned about frat boys exercising their constitutional rights on campus, or would you suppress the right for all students? :)

Students are not denied their constitutional rights to own guns, just their ability to have them in certain situations. This bill was widely opposed by law enforcement, and the universities themselves.

Don't like it? Don't live on campus.
 
Just throwing this out there. Do you not think that a candidate can learn(become better informed) of an issue in spite of their current beliefs? I'm not just asking in this situation as I believe this is an issue on both sides of the isle. I'm always confused why politicians are afraid to admit that they don't know everything about every issue. Why can't they just say that they will try to surround themselves with people who are better informed on the issues and give names?
Maybe I'm being naive but I'm tired of seeing politicians wearing hunters orange or using the NRA as their crutch while trying to make us believe they are avid sportsmen when more than likely they are "all hat no cattle"

For instance what if Cruz were to re-think his stance on land transfer and change? Would you still want to stone him? Seems Trump has flip flopped on multiple issues over the years but he freely admits that his opinion has change on some of them. Is it a problem for him or Cruz to do so? Maybe Gianforte re-thinks his comments and beliefs? Just wondering
 
Just throwing this out there. Do you not think that a candidate can learn(become better informed) of an issue in spite of their current beliefs?
Maybe Gianforte re-thinks his comments and beliefs? Just wondering

I think they can, and good leaders do. However, we know that because of all the bias inherent in the human melon, it is incredibly hard and unlikely for people to change their minds due to an increased awareness of the evidence.More often than not people change their minds due to a changing in how an idea makes them feel (personal emotions, social pressure, etc) . Greg Gianforte seems like an intelligent guy and I wouldn't speak to him specifically, but typically, the types of people who run for office are entrenched in their ideas. Taking their stances publicly entrenches them further, especially when their competition holds views to the counter.

So though I believe and hope that Gianforte could change his mind on elk, the fact that he already holds a belief that there are way too many elk in Montana, coupled with statements that the FWP has it in for landowners, I would put the probability on him changing his mind pretty dang low. I get that elk are just one issue in a bigger picture.

I really like Eliezer Yudkowski's essay Politics is the Mind-Killer. When it comes to human brains and political issues regardless of partisan bent, it nails it IMO.

"Arguments are soldiers. Once you know which side you're on, you must support all arguments of that side, and attack all arguments that appear to favor the enemy side; otherwise it's like stabbing your soldiers in the back—providing aid and comfort to the enemy."
 
Ben, Lots of questions for him before I'd vote for him regarding some of the things he said. Randy did a great job getting him to talk about things though.

I wonder if the landowner he mentioned that was suffering from all the elk had a fence around his haystacks, if there was a shoulder season there this year, how that worked out, and what that district object was at, and what the "overall" HD counts were now compared to 10 years ago.

He said getting everybody together to discuss issues was key. One would hope that as a result, some of the outlying details might slightly reshape his opinions/thoughts from what they are currently.

He used the work ideology multiple times, which is applicable to both those who are adamant Rs or Ds, unfortunately spot on with the quote at the bottom of the above post.
 
Ben, Lots of questions for him before I'd vote for him regarding some of the things he said. Randy did a great job getting him to talk about things though.

Absolutely agree. This was a great interview and Randy did an excellent job.

I wonder if the landowner he mentioned that was suffering from all the elk had a fence around his haystacks, if there was a shoulder season there this year, how that worked out, and what that district object was at, and what the "overall" HD counts were now compared to 10 years ago.

Only GG can answer that, but from my perspecitive, it was not that much different than stories we hear repeatedly from ranchers who have disallowed public access for elk in the past, or landowners who don't have the traditional ethic from years ago. But again, only GG can answer that.

He said getting everybody together to discuss issues was key. One would hope that as a result, some of the outlying details might slightly reshape his opinions/thoughts from what they are currently.

This has been the standard operating procedure of FWP and this governor for the last three years. I'm all for this kind of thing and have participated in groups like Finding Common Ground, and PLPW in the past. We have Citizen Advisory Committees to help inform decisions and local landowner-sportsmen groups that have been working on these issues for a long time. I wonder what he's thinking when he brings this issue up, or maybe he's simply unaware of all of the efforts that have been moving forward to bring people together?

He used the work ideology multiple times, which is applicable to both those who are adamant Rs or Ds, unfortunately spot on with the quote at the bottom of the above post.

Largely, I agree with that when it comes to certain factions of parties. What I've found at the legislature and among groups is that people are looking for solutions and willing to work together. It's the bomb-throwers on the fringes that make it more difficult than it should be.
 
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