Which is more powerful??

1_pointer · Apr 4, 2001

As many of you know I am new to this whole rifle thing. While looking up various things this past weekend I ran across this.

While the 444 Marlin may not be as common as it's cousin the 45-70Govt, it has a definite edge on power. The overwhelming popularity of the new lever action carbines has generated a explosive interest in this caliber. This is a powerhouse, capable of thumping the nastiest of bears or the biggest moose.

Now I understand that either of these two would make GREAT big game rounds, I had always heard(understood?) that the 45/70 was the most powerful of the two. The loads this website offers shows that they have more ME, but that is not what I have seen on other tables. What's the deal here? Thanks for the help.

danr55 · Apr 5, 2001

1 Pntr, The loads that you see on commercial sites and in most loading manuals have a distinct handicap. In order to prevent any litigation, they must show loads that are safe in any 45-70 that is liable to be shot. That includes some Trapdoors, and older lever guns, some Remington Hepburns that were made around 1900 or before. These older rifles are not necessarily capable of withstanding the chamber pressures of modern firearms. What you should look for is a manual that lists 45-70 loads for modern weapons like the Ruger #1 as well as loads of older rifles like the Springfield Trapdoor. Then you can get a more equitable comparison.

sirfilbert · Apr 5, 2001

Onepoint- Found loadings for 444 Marlin and (modern)45-70. The 444 with a 300 gr. bullet @ 2100 fps generates 2937 ft/lbs at the muzzle and 2013 ft/lbs at 100. The modern loading for the 45-70 (boltactions and single shots) showed a 350 gr. @ 2100 fps. generated 3426.5 ft/lbs at the muzzle and 2432.5 ft/lbs at 100 yds. It was also interesting to note that the 45/70 dropped less at 200 yds. with a 100 yd. zero due to a better B.C. I wouldn't have thought it but the 45/70 in modern arms can be quite a performer. Regards Sirfilbert

1_pointer · Apr 9, 2001

THanks for the help fellas.

Pecos · Apr 9, 2001

1_pointer,

I load my bolt action 45-70 to 2300 some odd fps with a 300 grain bullet. It bites on both ends. I won't quote the load here as it is not in any manuel and was developed by me for my particular rifle. It is safe ONLY in Ruger or Browning single actions and modern bolt actions.

It is only about 150 fps less than a 458 Win Mag and the energy is close also.

Just my two cents.

Pecos

The Greek · Apr 10, 2001

1Pointer
Don't get so hung up on the ballistics of things. I have learned long ago that I get better patterns and kill just fine with out using maxed out loads. A elk for example will drop just as fast with a 45-70 going 1800 fps as it will with it going 2100 fps. My main hunting rifle is a 7 MM Rem. mag. and I only use 139 Grn Hornady's loaded to 2850 fps. That is NOT a hot load for this cal. actualy it is rather slow and small for it and it works graet for me. I have taken sevral elk,mule deer and predators with it. You dont need to load hot to make it work well. Just my .02

Which is more powerful??

1_pointer

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danr55

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sirfilbert

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1_pointer

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Pecos

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The Greek

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