Stupid poachers

We have all seen the "stupid criminal" stories on the news. Post up your stupid poacher stories. I have had to deal with far to many poachers but this guy takes the cake.

It was about 15 years ago and one of my best friends and his wife from was out to see if his wife could fill her tag on a nice buck. I had one located on some state and BLM ground. A old buck about 24 inches wide with short forks but massive antlers. We drove up a side creek and walked about a mile south to the top of big hill in the dark. From the hill we could see most of the country were I figured the buck would be. We had been glassing for a half hour when my friends wife said "I have a nice buck". Sure enough there he was chasing doe 3/4 of a mile to the west and only 200 yards from the county road. I told my friend "we might as well set here and watch him till he beds down and then we can go after him.

After fifteen minutes of watching we could see a pickup coming down the road. The buck was up on the top of a steep little hill and we were hoping the hunters in the pickup would not see him. It was state land and they would have every right to take him. The pickup was going at a good speed but when they saw the deer they slammer on the breaks and came to a skidding stop in the middle of the road. The driver jumped out, took a rest over the box of the pickup and took two shots dropping the buck on top of the hill. I looked at my friend and said, " If we hurry we can turn this guy in for shooting from the road.

We ran off the hill as fast as we could and jumped in my pickup and headed west towards the county road. When we were approaching the county road we could see the poacher truck a few hundred yards ahead of us. I figured that when he saw us he would make a run for it so I punched it in hope we could get a plate number. He saw me coming and pulled over to the side of the road. I couldn't believe our luck. I pulled up along side of him and my friend told him "you better stay here because you are in a bunch of trouble. He replies "I didn't do anything wrong, I have my tag right here". He them pulls his tag from his hip pocket and shows it to us. I am thinking, "violation number two". We tell him we were going to call the warden and he would decide if he was in the right and it would be best for him to wait for the warden to get there.

My friend drives back to the house to call the warden and his wife and I wait behind the poacher's (Andy) truck. Andy and his 8 to 10 year old son are setting in the truck. After a few minutes I see Andy has a set of regulations and is reading them intently. He is trying to figure out what law he is in violation of. After reading the regs Andy gets out of the truck with his tag in hand. He cuts his tag on the back of the truck and tells me he is going to tag the buck. I informed him it was to late.

I didn't want him to tag the buck because it would be his word against mine when the warden showed up. Andy had a problem, he didn't have anything to tie the tag on with so he asks me if I have something to tie it on with. I always have a some electrical tape with me during hunting season but I wasn't giving any to Andy. Andy is a bit confused about how to attach his tag so he sticks it in the deer's ear and asks me if it looks good. I say, "yup" knowing full well it wasn't a legal tag. About that time my friend gets back and tell us the warden would be at least another hour. Andy complains it will be too long and his ungutted deer would spoil. I an not waiting he tells us. I told him if he left the fines would be higher if there was any violations. He believed me and agreed to stay. I was thinking when the warden arrived it wasn't going to be Andy's deer anymore.

The game warden arrived and we went back to the were Andy shot the buck. The warden took us aside and we told him our story. He then asked Andy what happened. By now Andy has figured out were he is in violation. This was Andy's story. I was driving down the road when I saw the buck on top of the hill. I stopped and ran over to that bush (pointing at a sagebrush a good 20 feet off the road. When I got to the deer on top of the hill I cut my tag but forgot my string to tie it on with so I stuck it in the deer's ear. That was his story and he was sticking to it. He kid was standing there agreeing with every word.

The warden then asks Andy "if you shot from the bush over there how did your shell casings end up in the middle of the road next of the tire skid marks. Andy replies "Oh! Sometimes when you pull the bolt back fast they go a long way". The warden then asks Andy "If you cut your tag up on the hill how did the wedges end up in the back of your pickup. Andy replies "Oh! They must have got stuck to my hand" The warden then tells Andy "This is what I am going to do, I am going to give you a warning for hunting on state land with out a permit, I am going to cite you for shooting off the road and failure to tag you deer. Andy was ok with this. The warden then grab the buck and started to pull it out of Andy's truck. Andy yelled "what are you doing". The warden replied confiscating the deer. Andy was not ok with that. He yelled and threatened to go to court but in the end he paid the fines.

Antlerradar

Makes for a difficult read without a few paragraphs.

http://www.kare11.com/story/news/20...ntlers-seized-in-deer-poaching-case/22051239/

Here is a recent case in Minnesota. This guy was busy. 28 sets of antlers, 11 Mounts, some elk antlers and mule deer antlers. These types of people make me sick.

Couple of years ago, I videoed a licensed hunting guide snagging fish at a kid's fishing event. FWP had stocked some big spawned out brood fish to give the kids the thrill of a lifetime. This individual couldn't resist temptation and resorted to using a weighted treble hook to snag two fish. Legal limit was one fish over 22 in. and both of these were larger than that.

I was with my kids on the other side of the pond when I saw him attempting to snag. Thankfully, I had my camera. It was a superzoom model with a 42 power zoom and the video clearly showed the hook in the side of the first fish and under the tail of the second fish. He and his buddy that helped him land the fish then took them over to their families and took pictures and showed them off.

I turned the video and pictures over to the warden and thought my part was probably done. Boy was I wrong. Because he was a licensed guide and was afraid that he would loose his guide's license if convicted he decided to fight the four charges and $485 fine in court. His buddy was also charged and he wanted to fight the charge as well. The warden and county attorney contacted me and asked if I would be willing to testify at their trials. In for a penny, in for a pound as the old saying goes so I agreed.

The snagger's buddy wanted a bench trial so he went first. He appeared before the local JP whom I knew and had accompanied on a mountain goat hunt several years ago. After the video was played and testimony from myself and the warden, he was found guilty and his privelages were revoked for several years along with fines. He appealed the conviction and lawyered up.

The main snagger who had already requested a jury trial then asked for a different judge because as his lawyer alleged, "I had edited the footage to show her client in the worst light possible in order to curry favor with the judge and the warden and to get a $1000 Tip Mont reward." He was granted a new judge and a jury trial and his day in court.

After a day long trial and a 45 minute deliberation the jury returned a guilty on all counts verdict. As an interesting aside, defense struck all known fishermen from the jury pool. His jury consisted of six women from about 45 -60 years of age. This judge sentenced him to two years jail time (suspended), three years lost privileges and over $1000 in fines.

You would think that with two trials, two judges and two guilty verdicts, both guys would be reasonable and admit guilt. Not so.... He appealed his verdict as well so up to district court it went. Unfortunately, our local court is not a court of record so his appeal was automatically accepted. This is all dragging out over more than a year long period. I had to appear to testify and for interviews eight days over this time.

For the appeal the defense's strategy was to accuse me and the prosecution of hiding exculpatory evidence from the defense because I didn't turn over all the video and pictures that I took that day to the warden. ( The pictures and video were of my kids and people not connected to the poachers) . After more motions and hearings the judge ruled that the prosecution did not withhold relevant evidence from the defense.

Meanwhile, the prosecutor agreed to drop charges against the co-defendant in return for his testimony in the retrial of the snagger. He took that opportunity to write a scathing letter to the editor in our local paper, naming me by name and accusing the local judge of violating his constitutional rights among other things. Of course, he left out the part of the deal that included him testifying against his co-poacher. He complained of the thousands of dollars that he had spent to defend his innocence. (Poor fellow)

Long story shortened, the poacher realized that he was not going to prevail in another trial. He accepted a plea bargain that left his hunting privileges intact in return for him pleading guilty and paying $1,300 in fines. As far as I know he still has his guides license. You would like to think that guys like that would learn a lesson, but I doubt they will.

One other bit of information worth mentioning. His lawyers had done extensive research on me and pulled up several of my posts from Hunttalk to try and bolster their defense. They also Googled the videos I've posted online and went after me for a video where I failed to wear blaze orange when I shot my mountain lion (an oversight, but guilty because a lion is a big game animal) in an attempt to discredit me in the trials. Who knows, perhaps they are still Googling me to see if I post up any of the video evidence that was used in trial? If they are?.... You know who you are buddy. Hope those fish tasted good.

Back in the 80s I was bow hunting antelope in northern Colorado on the C.S.U. Maxwell ranch. I was in some timber and saw a couple of clowns in a pile of rocks out on the plains, about 300 meters away. They did not have permission to be there and were trespassing.

They had an arrow with a shit paper flag on it stuck in the ground about 30 yards in front of them, trying to entice a herd in. When the herd wouldn't come in, one guy laid down his bow and a .22 rifle appeared. A shot was fired and they took off after the antelope.

I ran like an SOB down to their pos and took the arrow and ran back to the trees. They came back, having failed to get their goat, and started looking all over the place for the arrow. You could just see their consternation. There was nowhere to hide for at least 300 meters and they had not been gone long enough for someone to come and take it without being seen (or so they thought; I was fast back in the day).

Anyway, I never saw them again. Good riddance, I say.

I always looked at the laws and regs as just another arrow in the quiver of animals in a contest where I've got the upper hand.

Gerald,

It takes fortitude to do what you did, and frankly, most don't have the stomach for it.

Well done...very well done.

I have a story, but cant really put it out there right now. But, I will say that so far, an elk was confiscated, an $1800 fine assessed and 2 other pending charges...

I didn't witness any of it, but this former gubernatorial candidate and world class asshat's legend still lives on: http://www.idahostatejournal.com/news/breaking/rex-rammell-to-be-charged-with-poaching-elk/article_9a563430-fcd1-11df-8f37-001cc4c03286.html

Of course he fought the charges, was convicted, appealed, and lost. It was such a traumatizing experience for him that he decided living in Wyoming would better suit his lifestyle.

well said BuzzH.
Thank you Gerald

Antlerradar

About 15 years ago my brother and I backpacked in about 6 miles before opening day of rifle. This was in SW MT. Got up to a ridge line opening day before light and we were in a good spot for elk to be moving through. We split up a bit and after 30 minutes or so I had a herd of about 20 head moving along a trail below me. There were 2 legal bulls (small, but legal) in the group. I didn't have a clean shot through the trees - and then noticed another hunter had come up and was under 200 yards from me. I heard 2 shots - but didn't see anything because of the timber.

Fast forward to the late afternoon. My brother and I had both gotten bulls down. We met up at a lake to get more water and have a bite to eat. When we get there, we find 4 guys on horse back. Not to be rude, I strike up a bit of conversation. I notice one of them was the shooter from earlier in the morning. He tells me his name and occupation in Ennis, and then mentions that he shot 1 bull in the neck, but missed the other one when they were running. The guy then asks if my brother and I are gay. He says, "only a couple of queers would sleep in a tent together". I let it go, simply stating that this is my brother. I leave to get my water and the guy gets on his horse and is really rough with it.

I get my water, then leave. Guy is an a$$hole and I don't like watching him beat the horse. Plus we have 2 elk to pack 6 miles.

Fast forward to the next day. I run into another hunter that is camped out. He asks me if I was the one that shot a bull, cut the antlers off and left the rest ungutted. We went through where the bull was - and I knew it was the horse guy from the lake.

Later that night, my brother and I drove to town for cell service. I called the game warden and told him the story. He knew the guy and had been building up a case. I told the warden I would take him to the kill site, but he was more interested in documenting the incident. So I wrote the story up and had it notarized and sent to the warden.

A few years later I was watching the local news. The guys picture comes up on the leading news story. He ended up in jail for armed robbery, along with some other previous charges. http://mtstandard.com/news/local/judge-revokes-bischoff-s-bail/article_6cbf1ccd-6529-5222-8cf7-d21493a657ef.html

I was always kind of mad at myself for not being more aggressive with him in our conversation - but something told me to just get out of there. I'm glad I listened to my gut that time.

Gerald,

I'm glad you did what you did. It pains me to think how far this licensed guide would go on the wrong side of the law with big game if he cannot control his greed at a kid's fishing event.

Gerald,

Appreciate what you did man. When I first started hunting and fishing last year I was exhausted by the amount of people I met who were held in high regard in the community and were out there violating all kinds of regulations and openly discussing it. Good do know there are people out there trying to do the right thing.

HSi-ESi said:

The guy then asks if my brother and I are gay. He says, "only a couple of queers would sleep in a tent together".

Click to expand...

Be fun to go visit him in jail and ask him how sleeping in a cell with a guy is working out for him.

P.S. I think you did the right thing. I would imagine your family does too. F him.

Thanks for the support guys. I never doubted it was the right thing to do but I have to say it worked me up at the time. I had a lot of support from everyone who had seen the video and knew the guy, but it's a small community and he spread a lot of stories about how he supposedly caught and released the fish and that the video was fake/edited. I even had a guy I know confront me on the job about how I was going to be sued for libel. He was friends with this guy's brother and believed everything the poacher fed his brother. To his credit he apologized for jumping to conclusions after I invited him to come to the house and see the video for himself. I even told him to invite the poacher's brother to come over and see the video to see who was lying. Needless to say, he never took me up on the offer.